Tuesday, May 7, 2013

Class Mechanics: Which Ones are the Best?

Of course asking a question like that will be bound to get different answers from everyone because it is opinion based but there would have to be some baseline where people do meet in their opinions.

What class mechanics do you think are best?

I'll start with the resources. 

There is mana, rage, focus, energy, runes, chi, etc.  The list can go on and on, even combo points, holy power, and the like are actually resources.  Which do you think is best?

I did not like the change to focus when hunters first got it.  It removed one of the things I loved about hunters.  We could provide burst on demand for target switching or PvP with mana whereas focus is a limited resource, extremely limited at that.  You can't just pound off 10 big shots in a row with it.  Heck, you can not pound off 3 shots in a row with it and that was initially a turn off for me.

As time has passed I would have to consider focus to be one of the resources I would seriously consider as the best resource in the game.  Sure, being caught with none makes you feel useless, just like needing rage and having none, being out of mana, or basically waiting on energy for what seems like an eternity.  But with the one focus class there are still some things you can do and one of them will even help you generate your focus back slightly faster.

Mana is a resource that just seems natural to me but that is probably because it is the main resource in basically every fantasy game you will ever play.  It is a staple.  My biggest problem is that it is a limited resource.  Sure it can be managed but the game is not fun when you are playing conservation all the time, at least not in my opinion.  In no area more than healing is mana annoying because of its limited quantity.  As such, while mana is the most comfortable or resources it could very well be the worst.  All other resources are not as limited as mana is.

But at least mana can be managed.  It is not energy.  The dreadfully slow generating resource of rogues and feral druids that basically keep me from playing them more than anything else.  Hey, I am a button masher and I like to always be doing something.  I can't with energy so while I might have issues with the limited resources of mana it will have to step aside for energy when it comes to winning the award for worst resource in the game.

How about them buttons?

Do you prefer a class with a lot of buttons you need to hit all the time or a few buttons?  Maybe you like the classes with a whole mess of long cooldowns and a few buttons.  Or a class with a lot of small cooldowns but an otherwise simple selection of abilities.

As a hunter I am not fond of the current design of 101 abilities, not because it eats up a ton of key binds but because it makes all abilities feel small and powerless.  It does however fill one of my likes in the game being a button masher, with 101 buttons and a resource that I can self generate there is always something for me to press.  And for new hunters that is the problem, being there is always something to hit there is always a chance to make an error and hit the wrong thing.

When I tested out shadow priest DPS for the first time ever this expansion I was surprised what it felt like to play a class with so few buttons after the changes to hunters.  I've actually started to rebel against the 101 buttons and have been enjoying the priest, shaman and rogue lately for the simplicity.

The beauty with fewer buttons, to me at least, is that the "big ability" actually feels powerful.  With many abilities, to even things out, you can not have the big ability doing huge damage because it would make that one class over powered.  So I would have to say, for sake of feel and game play I like lesser buttons.  Not because it is easier, but because hitting that big ability just feels more rewarding when there are only 3 or 4 other abilities between it instead of 13.

Building, DoTing or bashing, which feels better?

You have the building classes. Build combo points to cast a finisher, build chi for a power shot, build holy power for a more powerful ability, build stacks of arcane power before your bigger shot, build rage to use defensive cooldowns.

You have the DoTing classes, with lots of debuffs you need to keep going, or self buffs too.  Like the warlock or shadow priest or feral druid with their personal buff and DoTs on the mob.

You have the bashing classes where they might have a little building and a little DoT to worry about but it is more attacking that it is all about, the buffs and / or debuffs kind of take care of themselves.

I like the bashing class.  Hunters are mostly a bashing class.  Sure they have one DoT they need to worry about and any other DoT they might throw on kind of takes care of itself as it is part of the normal rotation.  No upkeep needed for black arrow or explosive shot other than firing it.  That is more enjoyable, for me.  No worries, just do your job, kill stuff.

As far as the absolute worst class in the game for things they need to worry about that award needs to go to the feral druid.  Self buff they need to keep up, a few DoTs they need to keep up, combo points, refreshers, finishers, all that and a rotation too.  No thank you blizzard.  When playing feral I feel like I spend the entire fight watching buffs, DoTs and debuffs and never actually beating the mob up.  The mob is just there to use as an instrument to keep my stuff up and rolling. Yeah, no thanks.  Worst class in the game for feel is a feral druid.  I never feel like I am a team player or I am beating up the boss, I always feel like I am watching timers and making sure to keep everything up at all times and that alone is a full time job.  Sure, the good numbers do come with doing all that but it doesn't feel fun.  Not at all.

So in my opinion just bashing feels the best for a damage dealer but can also be the most boring once you have got it down.  So some minor building or DoTing might be nice even for the bashing classes.  At the moment however, when it comes to what feels best in game, I would be left to say, nothing.  Not one single class in game feels good right now with how it is played, not even my beloved hunter.  But hunter does remain the best but I am a bit bias there.

How about healing?

I have yet to delve too deep into monk healing but as I get closer to 90 I am reading up more and more on it and am left to wonder what drugs the people on the creative department are smoking.  We are talking about a player base here that can not handle the maze in LFR.  Even the people that say, put a marker on me I know what to do, routinely lead people straight to their death.  The player base is horrible and sooner or later blizzard is going to have to acknowledge that and accept that they can not and will not ever get better or learn, they are children of the modern age and they expect things to be given to them without work and effort.  So why make a healing class with three resources, all that work off each other?

I am looking forward to hitting 90 and trying healing.  I look forward to the challenge.  But I can already tell that it is something that can become overwhelming frustrating quickly.  So monks that have been healing can give their thoughts on that.  I'll just leave mine to all I have read about healing and label monks as the absolute worst healing class in the game, mechanic and feel wise.

Now to play and the ones I have played.  I have never been a fan of the druid healing model.  HoTs are nice, but it seems to be the focus point for druids.  I gave up on healing with them in early cataclysm and never looked back.  But when 5.3 comes out I intend to go healing again on my druid thanks to being able to choose what type of gear you get.  I refuse, with a passion, to tank LFR but I do not mind healing it as much, so I will make a healing set and heal it for my tank gear.

Paladins are the same for me.  Love the tank spec, hate the healing spec, but I will roll heals for the LFR alone.  Not sure exactly why it is that I dislike paladin healing.  It has always been powerful, even over powered.  Has been for an extremely long time.  But I am not about playing the flavor of the month.  I don't like the feel of paladin healing.

Now priest healing feels right.  They have a lot of tools, too many if you ask me, but they can do a bit of everything.  They can raid heal, tank heal, spot heal, DPS and heal, they can do it all.  They are a solid healing model.  However, I choose the lesser of the two healing specs, disc.  I know, it is powerful, but it is still the lesser of the two even if it is doing better than holy at the moment.

The reason I like disc is I really enjoy the play style.  I enjoy preemptive healing and they are masters of that.  Their shields are very powerful and in random content like the LFR if you are a good disc priest the other healers will all have low numbers, not because you are so good, but because of the mechanics of the disc priest.  A good disc priest makes everybodies life easier.  I think the disc direct heals can really use a boost.  Their big heals do not do nearly half as much as the other classes but I guess when played correctly the shields do compensate a fair deal for that.  Either way, disc healing is a great deal of fun and I like the mechanics of it.

Last but not least, the shaman healer.  The class I labeled the best 5 man healer in the game a long time ago and still the one I think is the best 5 man healer in the game.  They have more tools than all the other healing classes that do not actually count as heals, like an interrupt.  If an ability is going to do 2M damage divided among the group and you interrupt it, you have effective healed for 2M with one spell.  I believe all healers should have an interrupt.  I believe it should be off the global cooldown so they can cast it at any time.  Interrupting is basically healing before healing is needed to be done.  Stopping 2M damage from happening is the same as healing for 2M.  Why don't all healers have interrupts?  No, seriously.  It is a healing spell.

But all the other shaman tools, not just that, are why I think shaman are the best 5 man healer.  CC, slows, added DPS, an off tank, even instant revival if they die.  Plus their heals are made for small groups tightly spaced and together.  Healing raid and chain heal are perfect for 5 mans.

Does this extend to raids?  Yes and no.  If you want to have a lot of shaman healers in your raid you really need to have a group of people that are smart enough to stand in places that will benefit from the shaman healing style.  So they could be good.

Play style wise, shaman are the best.  They have a lot of tools and are very new player friendly.  If you have never healed and would like to heal this is the class to learn on.  It is a simple healing rotation and has many powerful tools to use in a pinch.  Can't really say it gets much better than that mechanics wise.  But I can see how the massive amount of tools they have can really scare new healers off.  But like I said, stick with just the basic heals and in a 5 man a shaman will be just fine and can take the time to learn how to use all those tools. 

The simple one type of heal for every situation is why the mechanics of being a shaman make them the best healing class in the game mechanics wise as I see it.  Simple and complex all in one package so anyone from the beginner to the advanced player can get a lot out of it.

What about tanking?

Just like monk healing I have no experience monk tanking.  I do not level in dungeons and felt like trying the DPS spec while leveling.  On a side note, monk DPS is nice and simple and easy and extremely over powered when done correctly.  Just thought I would say that.

I do however tank on all other tank classes.  My warrior however I have left for dead.  It just does not feel the same as well as feeling under powered compared to the other tank classes.  My paladin feels okay but the loss of righteous defense makes me want to never tank on it again every time I think of it.  It was a simple ability, a taunt off a target ability, and I loved it.  Why did they lose a mechanic like that?  When taking I think we need more simple mechanics like that.

My only active tank is my druid.  Even my DK I do not tank on all that often.  I like the rage changes some, not much.  I do miss the gaining rage when getting hit.  That made sense.  But I do like the generating rage using abilities, the problem is, it always feels like it is not enough.  But an incarnation with mangle spam and frenzied regeneration can keep me up through anything allowing the healers to concentrate on others.  So I really can not complain in all cases even if I do miss the fact rage used to be tied to damage.

I can't rightfully say anything has changed with the DK model since the change to all tanking models being DKs were always designed as an active mitigation class and while many seem to dislike that model I love it.  I find it bring a lot to the role of tank and puts my survivability a little more in my own hands.

I like the active mitigation model but I still believe it needs a little work to make it better.  At the moment there are no tank classes I would say work well or smooth.  They all have their moments.  DKs might be the best of the bunch but that bunch is a bunch of badly designed class abilities thrown together.  So the new style can be a winner but it just hasn't reached that point yet in my opinion.

What class types do you like?


  1. Well my protection paladin is my main for a reason. To be honest with this subject who wouldn't pick their main? More to the point if you don't pick your main why are you playing it?

    Anyway let's look at it logically. It uses mana rather than rage (druids/warriors), death knights (runic) or energy (monks). I've always had issues with rage and not having enough of it, rage starved just puts me right off. Energy actually wasn't that bad, it regenerates fast enough on the monk. I actually tanked MSV with it, it's not bad though I don't feel like I have the same survivability, well not the same self healing anyway. Death knights I have trouble understanding, just personal preference there. With my paladin I always have enough resource, it barely dips below max ever. I never run out. I don't have to manage it in other words.

    Other resource system. Monks have chi which work a lot like holy power. Warriors don't have anything, I don't think that guardian druids do either, death knights have runes which I struggle to understand. Holy power is simple and easy, it's even better now that you can build 5 but only spend 3, banking some works really well. There's no mixture of what costs what, it's all just three holy power. Simple and straightforward.

    Cooldowns and buttons. Warriors to me have a hell of a lot of buttons, I don't have enough keybinds, also find it confusing. Monks also have a lot of buttons on the face of it but less in practicality. Death Knights are just odd, so much is tied into the rune system, even the cds which I'm used to being independent. It's disconcerting to want to press something and not being able to as you don't have the right mix of runes. As for druids I have mine at 90 but I haven't really tanked on it this expansion and it's changed. The old cd combo of enrage and frenzied regeneration doesn't seem to work the same. I also seriously miss my bear/cat combo which colours my perception but that's another matter. Paladins and warriors might be similar in terms of their buttons, and it's only my lack of experience on the warrior that sees me viewing it differently. I know what the often used and effective buttons are on the paladin, I have the others available but they don't intimidate me.

    How they tank - I think monks are squishy, even though I've played one a bit semi seriously I still think that. I used to refer to warriors as poor mans paladins and in some respect I still think that. They are paladins without the self healing and the self healing is essential for me. Druids are ok I think, I last tanked semi seriously in Firelands, I can do 5 mans alright but a trained monkey could say that. Death knights can be awesome, my friend is a dk, but I think I might be with you on the button mashing, I can't rune juggle, and so I don't have my heals/big abilities when I need them.

    Paladins on the other hand, especially haste paladins, have fantastic self healing, frequent easy blocks, and then 3 simple cd packages for managing big attacks. They also have amazing utility with the different hands available. I tank Horridon the whole time, allowing my co-tank (dk) who's better on adds to do the doors, I can cleanse my stacks with HoP/Divine Shield. I solo tank Dorumu allowing for far more dps as not only does my dps double, thanks to vengeance, but we can take another dps who does double/triple what another tank would do. Again I cleanse the stacks with HoP/Divine Shield. I can soak a ton of pools on Ji-Kun because of Hand of Purity and then bubbling the excess away. Also thanks to Hand of Purity the red head dot on Magera hurts far less, meaning we don't have to swap ever like some strats suggest, popping Devotion Aura also helps with the green circle explosions.

    1. .... continued (I know I wrote too much)

      I don't know any other class/tank class as well as I do the paladin so I could be biased. I do think that paladins bring a lot to the table. Great survivability, great utility, great dps for a tank, on any fight where I get good vengeance I usually top the meters. We can also help out with raid healing with Battle Healer glyph, it might only be a small addition but isn't to be sniffed at. On bosses with a lot of raid wide damage it has been the difference between someone living or dying, as it's ticked enough for the healers to then save them. We can also help with dispelling poison/disease. My dispel is constantly on cd on those doors on Horridon as I help dispel the raid.

      I just don't think any other class can measure up. Tanking wise of course, as that's all I'm addressing. Please feel free to argue with me though :)

    2. I can't argue with you there. I love all those little tools paladins have and it is why it is the only tank I make sure to have heal bot on. I use it for hand targets, cleanse targets, etc. Takes a whole mess of time away from having to find and target someone.

      They are the hunters of the tanking classes. 101 buttons. They can be effective it is optimal even using very few of those buttons, just like a hunter.

      I just find them a little cluttered and this is coming from a person that is not afraid of 101 buttons as a hunter is my main. But that perhaps comes with not playing it all that much for the last 2 years really. I forget what I have things bound too, forget my rotation, forget my cooldowns, and I am always looking at the images on the screen instead of just hitting the keys because I know were everything is bound.

      As far as the warrior, they do have a lot of buttons but in my opinion at least they can never come close to holding a candle to paladins. Paladins triple the amount of things you need bound but at least I can use heal bot to negate most of that.

      I just miss righteous defense and I still feel like if they do not add it back, I don't want to play it.

      I want the AoE taunts and the direct taunt off someone like that back. I hate they removed those and can not understand why.

    3. Responding to Taitrina's original question first, why wouldn't someone pick their main? Not everyone's main is their toon of choice, some raiders will play a toon or a role out of necessity, not choice.

      I'm having a hard time answering this question. My favourite dps specs to play right now are Windwalker Monk, Fire Mage, Elemental Shaman and Arms Warrior, Frost DK... Combat Rogue would be on the list but only at higher haste levels, regen is too slow in my current gear. I'm all over the place... energy, mana, rage... single resource, dual resource... melee, ranged...

      I think it ultimately comes down to whether a rotation feels smooth. I like smooth. I don't like having to sit and wait for resources and I don't like having 5 abilities all do roughly the same damage, I like to know what button to push when there are 2 or 3 available. I enjoy procs, within reason (I like them more for WW Monks than Frost DKs, even though they're very similar, for instance, mostly because the WW ones are resource-free, the DK ones require resources to use... again, I like smooth, when a button lights up, IT MUST BE HIT NOW).

      For tanks, I probably like DKs the most. My DK feels strong and I feel like I have control over situations. Too many CDs but there are always tradeoffs. I think Monks have the highest potential ceiling for enjoyment but I'm not at that skill level yet. The flexibility of being able to bank abilities when the other guy is tanking the boss so you'll have max usage when it's your turn is fantastic. My pally used to be my tank of choice prior to Holy Power, hasn't been the same since (combining rotational abilities with cooldowns + having to manage a secondary resource = unsmooth). My druid just feels weak, even when rearing up and smacking things in the face, I feel too reliant on the healers to keep me alive. I haven't done much warrior tanking but it seems solid and the mobility is a lot of fun. I also like shields aesthetically. Could use some passive rotational self-healing, though.

      For healing, Atonement >>> all. For "traditional" healing styles, Disc or Resto Shaman would be my two picks. I feel borderline useless on my Druid in LFR, may as well just spam Wrath and hit Wild Growth on CD. Pally healing is okay, they at least have the tools to do most jobs, but I haven't done it much. I tried Monk healing a bit when deciding on a second spec but was in over my head before I was even half-way through the learning process. I suspect this is another one that becomes very powerful and fun at higher skill levels but it's very intimidating for someone first looking at it. I was also hoping that Fistweaving would be a viable melee version of Atonement but it doesn't seem to be, more of a supplementary time filler that does a bit of bonus healing.

    4. My main is still my hunter even if I have tanked more raids then I have DPSed in for the last 2 expansions. I do like the shared achievements for that reason. Now I do not feel as frustrated leaving my main on the shelf for the needs of my guild and raid team. Just because I do not raid with him as much does not change the fact he is my main.

      I have that it must be hit now feeling too and one of the reasons I like WW monk DPS. I get the same issue with frost. Must hit it... damn, can't. And that if frustrating.

      I can't wait to try monk healing and tanking at 90, not there yet, but it looks like it could be something fun to learn. I have no doubt that they will water it down next expansion because as you said, you need a high skill level to play them well and there are very few people in the game that have a high skill level.

    5. I'm mainless mostly by choice, I try to treat all of my toons more or less equally. At the start of an expansion they'll all get equal opportunity at being played first or most and they duke it out for my attention. I find the flexibility to be an overall benefit but not everyone agrees, players with absolute mains and alts can have a hard time wrapping their heads around my "who do you want me to bring?" mentality.

      I look forward to hearing stories about your monk healing experiences at max level. There doesn't seem to be much middle ground for monk healers, they're either awesome (I've been running with a great one lately so I've seen it first-hand) or very average, doesn't seem to be much of an opportunity for someone who's good but not great.

      I think you'll do fine with monk tanking, though, having active control over your defenses is a nice thing.

      I'm not sure monk tanking is any worse than druid tanking in terms of complexity... druids have it a bit easier in that an AFK tank will be a bit easier to keep up (better passive survivability) but they have roughly equivalent abilities, the monk ones are just more powerful and controllable to compensate for the lower baseline protections. A monk tank who has even a decent ability to deal with Stagger will be no worse than any other tank, IMO. Plus, there's something really cool about having a spammable (no CD) ability with zero resource cost. Nothing else to push, push that. It's the "always needs a button to push" dps mentality answer to a tank spec. Do any other tanks have a spammable, resource-free rotation button? Not sure about warriors, pretty sure the others don't.

      I also forgot to mention something in my original response, I don't like having to sit and wait in order to be able to push buttons. I'm okay with it occasionally but there are limits. According to SimC my combat rogue is inactive something like 37% of the time with an OPTIMAL dps rotation. 37%!! That's not good. I'd be much happier with that rotation if it was 10% inactive. Arms warriors and frost DKs are a more appropriate amount of wait, there are usually buttons to push but you don't feel like you have to pre-push to be optimal like you do with a caster.

    6. I'll aim for very average and be happy with anything I can get above that. ;)

      I think it will be fun to try to do and interesting how the triple set of binds I will need will work. Even if I have never speced healing yet on it I have my UI set up in my head already. Is that strange? I don't think so. I just look forward to the challenge even if I don't actually expect to be good at it.

      I remembered my first time healing a monk tank in a random. Fine, fine fine, fine, dead (in one global). WTF you were just at full health. Sorry, I am new to monk tanking. No problem, lets take it slow. lol

      I am with you on the waiting thing. I actually like my rogue, even if I am not all that good at it. I enjoy sneaking around, I enjoy picking people pockets, I enjoy the simple 4 button rotation, I enjoy having a little control with stuns and interrupts, I like the class but I HATE the waiting. Hence the reason I do not play it as often as I might actually want to sometimes. Hearing need more energy 5000 times per raid is not my idea of fun.

  2. I think every tank class has different things they are good at. I like my druids snap aoe of thrash + swipe. I like the warriors mobility, but I feel aoe is weak. It's like I'm always waiting for an aoe ability to come off cooldown. I like the warriors block physical vs block magical active mitigation though. I haven't really been a fan of the healing type of active mitigation on my druid. I'll have the rage to cast a heal, but not need one, or I'll think I need one only to be hit with a big heal right as I hit the button. I'll be close to rage capping so I use an ability and then will not have enough rage for a max heal a split second later when now I do need a heal. I prefer the avoidance/mitigation versions of active mitigation. At the same time the self healing can be huge when it basically means the healers can avoid the tank or for soloing. Maybe it's just mostly memory of a tanks job used to be more about picking up mobs, positioning the best for the dps, and cooldowns for big abilities you know are coming. It was more monitoring your environment than monitoring yourself. Definitely notice a lot of tanks now not worrying or thinking about how they are positioning a mob for the dps.

    Feral is my main, and maybe that's the only reason why I find it so easy, but I actually like the fact that with feral it's just is all my stuff up? Yes - then I'm good. I find I can autopilot my druid and worry more about the encounter mechanics then I can other classes. I also like the ability to use some of my utility to help out the raid without sacrificing my own dps as much as other classes do to provide utility. Hunter I'm constantly trying to think what do I push next if multiple things are available, will I have enough focus for that high priority ability or not, but that's probably more just from experience. Mage it seems to have become more about managing lots of procs or charges or the size of an ignite. It used to be more about managing your mana cooldowns so you could always be casting something. Warrior dps I love for questing or pvp because it's individual abilities are simple and hit hard. It's very much a smash type of play. It can get boring in a raid though as it's too simplistic at times when you push the same four buttons over and over for minutes or hours on end.

    1. Those old things you mentioned of as a tanks duty I still think of as a tanks duty. I can't tell you the number of times I have said something to a tank in training like, the melee can not get them if you tank him there and the tank says, you are a hunter, why does it matter. But that is beside the point.

      That will always be what separates the good tanks from the bad ones. The good ones think about positioning, not only of themselves but of everyone else in reference to where they are.

      Your feral and my hunter, I think that comes down to experience. You can go on auto pilot while doing feral where I am always worrying what is next and I can go on auto pilot as a hunter while you are always worrying what will come next.

      In a way they both have a steep learning curve for DPS, although I think feral is deeper as they have to monitor a few things whereas a hunter has to react to multiple things being available all the time. I personally think all that monitoring is harder to do.

      They both need a lot of practice to do well. Feral planning and execution and hunters in decision making and snap judgements.

      I am sure either of us, being able to do one, can do the other if we put enough time and effort into it. The thing is I just do not enjoy the feral style. I am guessing from what you say you do not enjoy the hunter play style.

      I agree on warrior DPS. They seem to be the best made class in the game that mimics exactly what we would imagine them to be. Hit hard and smash everything.

    2. Agreed, tanks should still be paying attention to that stuff, they just don't. First boss of ToT is a prime example in LFR, how often do you see the tank standing in the pool and not giving dps a chance at his back? Yay, 50% more tank dps at the cost of about 10x as much lost damage for the melee dps who are stuck punching him in the face.

      Speaking of that, are hunters still able to be blocked when attacking from the front? That's been an issue in previous expansions (one that I haven't seen discussed much) but I haven't checked in MoP yet.

      Funny you guys should mention kitties and hunters, kitty druid is the only dps spec in the game that I've absolutely, consistently failed to be decent at and I've been trying to use it since Wrath. That's a long stretch of failure. I leveled up my L1 auction alt rogue in early Cat just so I could spend more time with that particular playstyle and hoping it would translate to my kitty, who I anticipated would be my main. Long story short, I was still crap at kitty but I did get really good on my rogue to the point he became my primary raiding toon for most of the expansion and my Boomkin came in handy on Cho'gall ('shroom slows FTW). I still have no explanation why... similar playstyle, the same resources...

      My hunter has always been a good but not great toon for me but at the moment he's my least efficient dps toon (vs SimC sims) at about 75%... most of my dps toons are in the 80-90% range. My somewhat undergeared rogue with crappy weapons is actually my highest at about 95%.

      So, I feel both of your pain but not much of your joy. :)

      My only issue with fire mage is reacting to a partial hot streak quickly enough since spell travel time is actually a factor... stack fights suck, there just isn't enough time for me to react. I have auras set up for the other things I care about (size of Ignite, it lights up at a certain level at which point I just hit Combustion, as well as Bomb status) but that's about it. There's a lot more to track on a kitty, especially since they all take time to prepare due to the combo point generation limitations.

    3. I see that all the time. Tanks just do not get it. But remember, they are the same ones that refuse to let the other tank take the mob even if it causes damage to everyone in the raid because their vengeance will go down if they are not being hit.

      While I love doing huge DPS as a tank I think they need to go back to the design that it is a tanks job to hold aggro, not to help with DPS. Too many tanks think they are just damage dealers that are getting hit for a buff.

      That is a good question. I still like to stand behind the mob, call it habit. I see see partial blocks on recount although they are extremely rare and I think are more mechanic based. So I would have to guess, no, they can not be blocked, but it does sometimes happen. Just like I have seen my tank get crit when they should not be able to. Rare, but it happens.

      Feral still escapes me too. Sometimes I will say the hell with it and break out my one button macro and use that. Not great but it will assure me 40K DPS at the worst and 83K DPS at the most, from the times I have used it. Not bad at all for one button. And that is with bear gear. Wonder what it could do with cat gear.

    4. That's odd what you just said about rogues and kitty druids.

      I have always been rubbish at rogues and I mean seriously, seriously bad at them. It got so bad that when I reached Deepholm when levelling I couldn't kill any mobs, not a single one. My friend formed a levelling combo with me or I'd never have made 85.

      Kitty druid on the other hand, in cata, was one of my favourite alts, my main alt in fact. I absolutely loved playing it and I was pretty good at it too. I shouldn't say that as it sounds egotistical, I'm not saying I was amazing but I felt competent on it. My gear was pretty subpar, I didn't always cap and I didn't raid on it. I sometimes wonder what dps I could have managed if I'd had better gear.

      I've always maintained rogues and kitty druids might work on the same principles of energy and combo points but that's where the similarities end. I find them very very different. Can't do rogues but love kitty (or at least I did). I'm not sure what makes them so different, it's obviously something as you guys have noticed it too.

    5. I too believed they would be similar but outside of using energy and combo points they don't seem to work the same at all. At least from my experience.

      I dislike the number of buffs, bleeds, debuufs you need to keep up as feral. That is my issue. I don't like to track a bunch of crap. That is also one of the reasons I did not like the old school locks but like the new ones better. Less DoTs to worry about and more time spent playing instead of watching timers to refresh.

      Lose all those timers and I would have more fun with feral but until then leave it for the people that like that stuff. It is not for me.

    6. Actually I love hunter too. It became my favorite alt even though it was just leveled at the very end of Cata. I just realize that while I'm getting good dps out of it (usually top couple in LFR) I know that I'm leaving dps on the table because I hit the wrong button a lot when there are three things that are available at the same time. I find myself being more oblivious of boss mechanics as well because I'm watching my abilities that are available. A lot of it does come down to experience.

      I think addons definitely play a bigger part than we realize in enjoyment/skill at playing a different class/spec. I've been playing feral long enough that I know what information I need and I can find addons to display it in a way that makes my job easier to get the most out of it. With a fire mage I didn't realize what information I really needed or how to display it so that I could get the most out of combustion or pyro procs until someone else recommended an addon. You go to play a new class and you have a lot of work to setup addons to get the most out of the class.

      Maybe it all boils down to experience though, because as you mentioned there is a lot to monitor with feral yet I love it and can auto pilot it. Yet when I tried a warlock, which you'd think would be similar to feral with monitoring lots of debuffs, I stuck to destro (the simplest of the three specs).

    7. So very true. I also have different UIs for different classes and specs based on how I like to use them. Just a comfort zone thing. I tend to change around abilities the more I play classes too on where I have them bound to better fit my comfort zone with them.

      Anything comes down to practice. The more you do something the better you get at it. I think the key is like you said, knowing what addons to use to display the information that is important to you and in the end that is what sets the players apart even at equal skill levels. One is using the tools they need to get that little bit extra.

    8. I actually find the playstyle between rogue and kitty to be very similar... same resources, both have a Slice&Dice-type self-buff (Savage Roar for kitty? Been a while...) that takes combo points, both have a combo point DoT (Rupture / Rip), both have a combo point spender when you don't have anything better to do with them (Eviscerate(Envenom)/Ferocious Bite)... I mean, they're basically IDENTICAL rotationally. Combat rogue actually has one more to worry about with the MoP change to Revealing Strike, although I long ago removed Rupture from my rogue rotation (removing a combo point requiring ability at the cost of a whopping 0.5% of my dps? Yes please...). Still, at the time when I was playing both and failing at kitty, they were basically identical rotations, if memory serves.

      All I know is that in the game gear my rogue tends to do twice the dps that my kitty does. I honestly have no explanation for it... makes absolutely no sense. At the time, kitty even had some advantages... Rip could be extended with a glyph, etc.

      As for hunter block, I'm wondering if Expertise becoming a hunter stat has impacted block... used to be that I could attack a target dummy from the front and get blocked so I'd always attack from the back (which wasn't always easy to do when there was min range required). I'll have to give that another try to see. In all the times I mentioned hunter block to tanks in the old days, none was ever aware of it...