Monday, October 21, 2013

Monday Random Thoughts

- Have another new level 90 in my stable.

- My first since 5.4 came out and my first to start the timeless island as a fresh 90.

- So I figure I would give you a run down of my gearing up experience so far with it.

- To compare, my monk hit 90 in 5.2 and was almost item level 500 in a matter of 24 hours, thanks to a lot of luck.

- This character, another priest, only managed to get to 487 in that same time frame.

- Odd being this one is a healer, so instant queue.

- Odd being this one has the island with instant 496 and 535 gear.

- Goes to show you that luck has more to do with gearing up than anything else and this priest has less luck than the monk did.

- So what did I do with a fresh 90 you ask?

- Here goes, the run down on how it was fun and exciting to gear up a new 90.

- Yes, my final conclusion is that it is more fun to gear a fresh 90 than it is to try and keep the gearing process up on an end game character.

- I went and purchased flying, that was the first thing I did when I hit 90.

- Still had 150 because, well, this character spent its entire life broke thanks to making the mistake of leveling tailoring and enchanting as my professions.

- So I was always spending everything I made on materials to keep it leveled.

- It was easier to do that than to go back and farm the stuff.

- Even if I did waste a lot of time tying to do just that because I had no gold to buy materials off the inflated AH.

- I think you should know I am not a fan of wasting time, if you read this often.

- Going back when there is leveling to be done is wasting time.

- Because of that I never did it often.

- I can always make gold later, I will just live with my 150 flying for now.

- I took the quest to the island and starting opening chests.

- Being this character is on a decent sized server it was not so hard to get to every single one of them.

- If there was a mob in the way, wait 5 minutes and there wouldn't be.

- One of the good things about being on a more populated server.

- I opened every single chest on the island first thing there.

- I was not about to start killing stuff at a 438 item level on a freshly dinged healer who does almost as much DPS as disc and he does in shadow.

- So chest hunting it was, and it did not exactly pay off.

- I managed to get 4 pieces of cloth.

- I could have completely decked out a leather or plate wearer, but no cloth for me.

- Still, it was nice to get a start on some gear.

- From killing rares I managed to get enough lesser charms to get some tokens, so back to the shrine to get some extra rolls.

- I then returned to the island and joined a celestial group.

- Gold and gold.  Darn, my monk got 2 pieces of nalak on day one, even if one was a PvP one it was still a nice start, so behind already.

- Joined an ordos group even if I really should not have been there with my horrible 34K DPS I was up to.

- Gold and gold.  Double darn, my monk got 1 piece of Oon.

- So my priest is already behind on gear compared to my monk gearing up.

- My monk also had a whole slew of characters that could make things for it, my priest is currently flying as the only character on that server, so no personal network going there.

- Even if I won nothing off ordos, my baggie did have something of use.

- A 540 cloak, not exactly a 559 warforged piece, but nothing to shake a stick at when you are wearing a 437 cloak wouldn't you say?

- The gearing up process is still the funnest part of the game, there is so much you can do to get gear.

- No sha or galleon groups, so that was out of the question.

- Did the two specific scenarios to start off the boot quest line, finished off getting my 502 boots.

- Then flying to thunder isle I passed by all those spots where some of those BoE goodies can be found, looking specifically for the caster ones of course.

- At 150 flying this was taking... a while.

- Oh, passed scritch, so you know what that means right?

- He drops the thing that gives rep for all faction, this character needs rep for all factions.

- Attacked him, died a horrible death.

- I am not geared enough and not very good at the priest fine arts of soloing.

- If I had a few more life points I might have survived.

- Got unlucky and he nabbed me while jumping around, that and the fact I ended up with 3 other monkeys on me including the elite that pats there.

- Actually I was surprised I lasted as long as I did, killed the elite and two of the three other monkeys while keeping dots and my proc plague on scritch.

- I almost did it and think I would have if not for the adds and not for a bit of bad luck getting nabbed by a jump.

- When I get back to my body he is dead already, someone else got him.

- That is one of the bad things about being on a slightly bigger server.

- I manage to get the 450 agility trinket, and do not use it.

- Come on, I do not need the item level that bad and no self respcting priest would use an agility trinket, even if it was a freebie.

- But I did consider it as it does has a passive 751 mastery which is not half bad really.

- I did nab the 450 neck piece for casters, but not the weapon sadly. 

- I also managed to snag a two handed sword which is not exactly going to help any.

- I get to the island and do the one lead in quest, because you have to do one to get in there.

- I do not do the others, as I know I am going to valor cap anyway and I will save them for when I am not capped, so I can get better use from them and the valor they reward.

- I go and kill one saurok, trying to get the quest for the saurok suit, so should I go to that area I do not need to fight my way through.

- It did not give me the quest but it did give me the key, and that was actually the reason I came here, for the key.

- I go through the solo scenario and end up with a full 20 elder charms of good fortune.

- Off to the LFR we go.

- First MV, instant healer queue, 2 DPS doing over 250K in there, 15 minutes later, one LFR raid down, 5 pieces of gear.

- Yes, I won something off all three bosses and got something off my coin on 2 of them.

- Upgrades?  None.

- You believe that?  Got 2 backs, 2 wrists, and a chest I think it was, all things I already had better of.

- What are the odds of winning 5 pieces on a freshly dinged 90 and not being able to use any of them?

- But hey, at least this character is an enchanter, so I did get something out of it, and this character surely needs to gold.

- Next part of MV, no 250K DPS to carry us, but an all together decent group.

- Most people doing 40K-60K which for the first LFR is exceptional.

- Amazing how the standard from tier to tier jumps huh?

- Or should we say it is amazing that there are still people doing only 40K-60K in SoO?

- Or actually let me rephrase that to should we be amazed that most people in SoO are still doing 40K-60K?

- That was good for MV, not so much for SoO.

- But back to the fun part of gearing up.

- Won lots more loot, even one piece I could use this time, more sha crystals otherwise.

- First part of HoF now, more loot, more stuff I can not use, what the hell is with my luck today.

- I have like 6 decent pieces, what are the odds that everything that drops, and I am getting a butt load of drops, I don't need any of it.

- I take a break between LFRs and grab a couple of friends on real ID, as I have none of the server being a solo player over there, and do a heroic scenario.

- Not the greatest thing out of my baggie, but an upgrade none the less, a 516 ring.

- Woot! Upgrade.

- Was sure it was going to give me a 516 back, being that is the only piece I have over 516 and that is the way my luck has been going.

- Do the last part of HoF, get a few upgrades which include a 483 sha touched weapon, I am a long way away from my legendary quest line being I just hit 90 and the sigils are not dropping for me, but a 483 weapon with the 437 off hand I had in my bag is surely better than the 429 two hander I was using.

- So I am happy.

- When I did my scenario I applied the rep to the august celestials.

- Being a tailor I want to get the bag pattern.

- I decided to do the AC dailies, to help it along, and the tiller ones, to open the farm of course.

- I capped valor and got my achievement for 1000 valor just as I turned in the last of the dailies from those two hubs.

- Yes, I planned it out that way thank you very much.

- Well, guess my playing with this character is over until next week.

- Sure, I could do more LFRs, sure I can get into ToES and the ToTs now, but without getting valor it seems like it would be a waste.

- I fly over to the valor vendor and get myself the Shado-Pan Assault neck with my newly gained valor.

- My gearing up week ends at 487.

- Not bad.

- Not quite knocking on the 500 door my monk had without the benefit of free 496 and 535 gear, but shows you the true impact of luck on drops and gearing up.

- But it makes me wonder, why does blizzard want people not playing?

- If it were not for a valor cap I would have kept going.

- So I was left with the choice of trying to gear up other characters, that would all need to do the current LFR, which is not an option, or find a flex, which I was in no desire or go searching for at the time, or to keep working on my new priest even if I would be wasting my time as I would not be getting valor.

- I decided to take option three and log off.

- If the only options I have are SoO LFR or wasting my time, I'll go watch TV.

- Unless you are really raiding in an organized group end game is just unplayable.

- Gearing up new 90s is so much more fun, sadly there is nothing to do with them once they get geared because the end game LFRs are so horribly designed.

- And as I mentioned, I am not a fan of wasting my time and not a fan of the current LFR groups.

- So I took the rest of the weekend off from WoW.

- Have a great day.


  1. "Unless you are really raiding in an organized group end game is just unplayable."

    Here's the thing... everything you did was end game, it just wasn't what YOU consider to be end game. Shaking that "if it ain't a progression raid, it ain't end game" mentality is the first thing I wish everyone would do.

    Dailies are (mostly) ONLY available at end game.

    Chests can ONLY be opened at end game.

    Scenarios can ONLY be run at end game.

    VP can only be earned (with any frequency) at end game.

    You can run world bosses (and I assume that includes Ordos) at less than 90 but that's still basically an end game activity. Probably won't have access to bonus rolls, though, I suspect that weekly token quest only opens up at 90.

    I think it's great that you sat your toon when you hit the VP cap... you had a week ender in mind and you stuck to it. Enjoyment > Benefit > Obligation whenever possible and it looks like you got stuck on the Benefit stage once you capped VP... and there's nothing wrong with that.

    1. "at end game" and "end game" are two completely different things.

      End game is SoO right now. Just because other things are made for the same level cap does not mean they are end game, it is old content.

      And, if it is not "current content" it is not end game is the appropriate mentality. Why should people shake the facts?

      Dailes are not longer needed for rep, so they are not end game.

      Chests are part of the fun part of gearing up I mentioned, but they are not end game when they only contain old outdated gear.

      Scenarios are fun I'll admit, but even when they were brand spanking new they where not end game.

      The only current end game content doable without much fuss or muss are the celestial and ordos world bosses.

      Gearing to get up to the end game is fun, I enjoy the gearing process. I enjoy the building professions . I enjoy the grinding rep, even if I do not need it, at my own pace.

      I do not enjoy the actual end game and like it or not "current content" is the end game. Like I said, no need to shake that mentality when that is a fact. Current content is end game.

      Current content is what is broken with the game for the non-raider.

      I did not leave off where I wanted to. I wanted to work on getting more gear for my tanks, I wanted to work on getting more gear for my healers, I wanted to work on getting more gear for other damage dealers. I couldn't because the end game (As in current content) is completely unplayable.

      So yes, I made my own decision and I am happy with it. But that does not change the fact the game is broken in its current form.

    2. You're ... so wrong that I'm not even sure how to respond.

      Gearing up is ONE ASPECT of end game. It ISN'T end game.

      End game is what you do at level cap, nothing more, nothing less. Calling your opinion a fact doesn't make it a fact, it's still just a (very narrow) opinion.

      Hell, in a literal sense, going back and finishing off quests you missed is an end game activity.

      SoO is the CURRENT TIER RAID. It's a PART of end game. It ISN'T end game.

      End game doesn't SHIFT. By your argument (I think), if I still need i522 gear from normal ToT, then normal ToT IS end game. Once I don't need it anymore, ToT IS NO LONGER end game.

      Reality check... what YOU consider end game, either for one toon, or for your entire stable, isn't what determines end game. End game IS ITS OWN THING, it isn't something that you can just arbitrarily change at your own whim, it doesn't change from player to player. What WE do as end game determines OUR end game, not THE end game.

      As a check, I wrote that up and just before hitting Publish I did a quick Bing check on "warcraft what is end game?" and clicked on the FIRST RESULT, linked here:

      So, yeah. Shockingly, they don't try to differentiate "at end game" and "end game" because there IS no difference, end game is end game. Unless you want to argue with WoWWiki...?

      Players who don't raid have end game, too. Seriously, this needs to be explained?

    3. Again, that is what "you" call end game. End game is current content.

      SoO is the current end game. Not part of it, it is it. Anything previous to that is leading up to that.

      Nope, if you still need 522 gear from ToT you are going to do "catching up" to get to the end game. The end game is not floating. It is the current content. Just because you never did ToT and might need it doesn't make ToT your end game, it is still old content. Catch up content.

      It isn't about what I consider end game it is what is end game. The current top level content is end game. You can not argue that.

      If you never purchased mists, DS is still your end game because it is the most current content for 85.

      If you level locked your character at 80, ICC and RS is end game because it is the most current content.

      End game is the last of the current content. It is not my opinion, it is a fact.

      That is like telling saying that being you never saw the walking dead season 3 that it is the current season. No, season 4 just started, so that is the current season, even if you never saw season 3. Season 3 is catch up viewing now. Tot is catch up raiding now. Got it. Not an opinion, not something "I" think. It is a fact. Current content is end game just like the current season is the new season. You can not argue that.

      Want to argue wowwiki? Sure, I am more than happy to argue someones opinion. Wowwiki is what someone wrote. Just as what I wrote here is just what someone wrote. Only difference is, I offered something to back up "current content" and they didn't even reference it.

      However, I will give you one thing, even if it is something you did not even mention.

      Each persons end game is different. Some people PvP, so that is their end game. Some people like dungeons and never raid, so that is there end game. Some people just work on achievements and reputations, things they can do solo, and that is their end game. For some LFR is end game, some it is now flex, some it is normal, some it is heroic. So end game is what you make of it. Each persons end game is different.

      However, with that said, the end game for the PvP person is the most recent (current) season. The end game for the dungeon runner is the most recent (current) release of dungeons. The end game for the achievements and reputations that you can get solo are the most recent (current) achievements and reputations you can get solo. For the LFR, flex, normal or heroic raider guess what their end game is? The most recent (current) raid.

      How amazing that end game is always dictated by what is the current tier isn't it?

      You level to 90 then you move to a different way of leveling and that is item level. All 90 content is not equal because some 90 content requires a different form of leveling, leveling with gear. The highest current gear level is the current end game.

      Call MV, HoF and ToES as level 90. Call ToT as level 91. Call SoO as level 92. If that makes it easier for you to understand, then go for it. But SoO is current end game.

      And to repeat what I said.

      The end game is broken for the non raiding player. It is unplayable.

      Feel free to argue that point all you want. But you can not argue end game. End game is current content.

    4. I must agree with the previous poster.

      You're SO wrong on this one Grumpy it's painful (really).

      End game is by definition what you do at level cap. If you haven't bought mist, then your end game is just smaller.

      YOU decided to narrow your end game at the last tier of raid.

      But what about ppl that don't care about raiding? What about ppl that are doing only pet battle once they reach level cap?

      I know quite a lot of ppl that are still progressing ToT HC because they want to clear it before moving to SoO, does that mean they have no end game?

      What about those that like go back to old content and solo stuff?

      Sure it's outdated content but it's still something you do at END GAME.

      What about those that do only PvP, are you considering they don't have end game because they'll never step into SoO?

      SoO is current tier, nothing more PERIOD.

      End game is what you do when you've reach max level, narrowing it to only the current raid tier is in my opinion missing the whole point of the game.

      Example : I'm currently raiding SoO HC, but I'm not raiding every night, the night I'm not raiding I spend most of my time on TI hunting for bloody coin. THAT is end game asweel, you can only do that at level 90.

      If you're really narrowing the end game to gearing and raiding, I feel sad for you

    5. We will agree to disagree.

      End, but definition is the end. It is not what leads up to the end. MV is not end game, SoO is. Even if they can both be done at 90.

      I am not narrowing end game to only raiding, I am talking about end game raiding.

      Difference, big one.

      While there are a million and one things to do at level cap (notice the difference, level cap, not end game) when talking about end game raiding that means SoO.

      Argue it all you want. End game raiding is SoO.

      To all raiders, everywhere, it might be LFR version, it might be flex version, it might be normal version and it might be heroic version. But when talking about end game raiding SoO is end game. End of story.

      Like I said, we can agree to disagree, but you will never made me say MV is end game raiding. It is not.

    6. A but you added a word here that change EVERYTHING.

      End game RAIDING is obviously SoO. But it's not THE end game in its entierety

    7. I didn't add a word at all. I might not have used the word "raiding" but I was talking about the new LFRs. I kind of figured it could be inferred that I was talking about raiding.

      I was talking about how the end game is currently unplayable because the groups in LFR are so horrible, the wait time is unbearable, and the community is toxic in them.

      If I am talking about LFR as part of the gearing up process, that means I am talking about raiding.

      So I did not add a word. I just expected people to understand I was talking about raiding.

  2. I think the problem is choice. You were in the mood to play your priest and the cost/benefit was no longer as favourable so you didn't want to waste your time. Fair enough. However, while it would have been less efficient as you'd only be potentially getting drops, rather than drops and valor, something was still available to do on the gear treadmill. It's when everything gear wise is exhausted then blizz is saying stop doing that, before that point though diminishing returns does kick in with the cap.

    Personally though I don't find gearing fun. I hate the gear treadmill. I like what I can do with good gear but outside of my main, where I accumulate gear as a matter of course, it's annoying to obtain. Gear in itself for me is never a fun goal. So I spend my game time outside raids ranting about the instance limit that means I can only kill Slabhide 5x an hour (190 attempts and counting, stupid mount), running around timeless isle for achievement drops and rep, massacring dinos for a primal egg, leveling my last 3 sub 90 chars to cap, banging my head in brawlers or proving grounds, flying around for archy or pet battles.

    I think blizz shouldn't put like the parental control of the cap in tbh. If you want to gear like mad then you should be able to because the game is what you make it. You like gearing, I find it deathly boring. Blizz should let us both grind away if we want to do that. Lose the cap, lose the instance limit.

    Would people be happy then or worse off? Would you run out of things to do if there wasn't an artificial sign saying take a break?

    1. I'm fine with weekly caps like the valor cap, but daily or hourly caps are a pain in the ass. I have limited play time per week and it's usually condensed to the weekends. I'm not a daily player (even though I've done a shit-ton of dailies), so daily limits are like having another job and hourly limits are just stupid...

    2. I too hate the gear treadmill, but I like playing catch up because you can feel yourself getting somewhere. That is hugely important in any fantasy based game like this. You need to see yourself moving forward.

      That is why I like catching up on a fresh 90. The gear comes fast and furious at you and you feel marked improvements. Like when you first reach that mark where mana no longer becomes the enemy. Or when you can trust your shield to actually absorb something other than incidentals. Or seeing that 30K shield go up, than the 40K one, then the 50K one and each time it goes higher and higher.

      That is the fun of gearing up, seeing yourself grow.

      I went from my new priest and his 34K shield to my main priest and her 240K shield. Wow, what a difference gear makes.

      I still need that mount too. :(

      I think that is exactly why blizzard puts limits, they are afraid people will get bored and quit. I don't think the grasp the concept that all that does is chase people away when the reach the limit. Someone like myself that would pass it is not going to quit because I am done gearing my priest, I will just move to another 90 to work on or go make another 90.

      @ Jaeger

      Exactly, limits make things jobs. No limits makes things choices.

  3. I'm trying to do the "end-game" without "raiding in an organized group" and I can definitely relate to the comments.

    LFRs are hit and miss, some are OK and some are just horrible. I have yet to have a good one in SoO. The one or two of us in the group doing 100k+ can't carry the rest who are doing < 60k. I've never seen so many enrage timers in LFR. Wipes, sure, people screw up and we wipe, but we don't hit enrages.

    I think it was GC who made a comment recently that enrages were because people weren't following mechanics... Sure if half the raid is dead due to mechanics, but that's not what I'm seeing. I'm seeing 20+ players alive at the end and we hit an enrage! WTF?!?! It's because half the raid is doing 30-50K DPS. That isn't good enough for LFR. Hell, it's barely good enough for heroic dungeons.

    On the loot front, I'm at 546:
    No loot off the Celestials yet, but I've gotten the warforged chest and legs off Ordos.
    I've got a 536 weapon and trinket from LFR already.
    I've got 7 543 items and one 535 that I still need to upgrade.
    And the legendary cloak of course.
    That leaves the 530 T15 gloves and 510 LFR T15 helm for T15 2pc.

    Based on FemaleDwarf and AMR, a T16 4pc set using 2 normal and 2 LFR is a downgrade from the 2pc using 2 normal and having 2 warforged items for the others.

    So I really only need to focus on the world bosses. Isn't much reason to do LFR. I still do them because I want to know the fights better, so that in case I get into a flex or normal, I generally know what to do. I really question it a lot though when I'm in there.

    Just realized, I haven't done Malkorok in LFR yet... Done that wing twice, but always start at Spoils. Yet that's the only fight I've attempted in Flex... At least I've seen it.

    On the alts side, my DK is 497 thanks to free 496 gear, etc. I don't want to actually play him though...

    I should level up my mage to 90 just to soak up all the 496 cloth tokens I have... She's an enchanter so she can DE the excess ones as well. I've just been vendoring the excess plate ones for my DK and mail for my hunter.

    Gamebreaker is starting their Gamebreaker Nation up soon. The WoW guilds will be on Turalyon-US. I created a toon on there just to see what's going on.

    I'm starting to get a collection of random (useless) toons on different servers:
    Turalyon-US Alliance:
    -lvl 6 monk
    -lvl 1 name reserver
    Proudmoore-US Alliance:
    -lvl 1 name reserver
    Earthen Ring-US Alliance:
    -lvl 1 name reserver
    Aerie Peak-US Alliance:
    -lvl 1 name reserver
    Icecrown-US Alliance:
    -lvl 22 WHU dwarven hunter
    Plus my 10 toons on Drak'thul-US Alliance.

    Still haven't decided what I'm going to do. Meanwhile, the handful of us left in the guild on Drak'thul are leveling it up... Just hit lvl 12... LOL.

    1. I've seen full groups, everyone alive, all doing mechanics, still missing enrage timers because they are not doing enough DPS. Once more GC proves he is clueless.

      I am still sitting with the 510 shoulders and 530 helm myself for last theirs 2 piece. I have 2 561 and one LFR piece for 3 pieces of the new set. Can't wait to get rid of them.

      I have not won anything since week 2 sadly, it started out nice and went back to my life is hell.

      Using 3 coins a week on 3 weapon bosses and no weapon yet, no nothing.

      I healed SoO normal the other day however and guess what dropped? I have a 100% drop rate on bosses that drop hunter weapons when I am tanking or healing and a 0% when I am on my hunter even using coins. I swear sometimes I get sick and tired of the RNG in this game.

  4. aha...... and you are quitting WoW?

    LFR is..... interesting. I can't help it, I enjoy the challenge to bring groups of semi capable "heroes" through shamans and general. But sometimes ... it's bad. Last Saturday I was #2 in damage done (almost #1) ... as tank.

    I think Blizzard makes a bad design error. Every DPS should be able to do 50% of max DPS with auto attack and ONE special attack. The complex rotations are just too much for LFR.

    Rauxis, chosen of CAT

    1. Nope, just stopped playing for the weekend. There was nothing to do so I didn't hang out online just for the sake of hanging out online.

      No matter how much I might want to run LFR for my alts, I will not subject myself to it.

      I had one of those on my healer. #1 in healing and #4 in damage done. Sad, isn't it?

      Your rotation would be too complex for most people I think. They just need to lower the requirements for them but at least 50% of what they currently are, and I bet you would still see a wipe here and there, but that would be fine. A wipe here is there in LFR is awesome. Having to wipe, expecting to wipe, is not good design for random content.

      I am learning more and more to play the game I want to play and not feel forced into playing the game blizzard wants me to.

      Maybe I should thank them for that?

  5. You're funny sometimes. Would a sub game care how much you 'keep going' like an obsessed freak that wants to finish everything in one week? Or would it be better if they made it so you come back the next week?

    1. They should want to keep people coming back. Bottom line. That is what sub games do.

      If people feel like there is nothing to do, they quit. If I want to work my ass off on one character this week and do another next week, it is my choice, just as it would be my choice to stop playing because there was nothing to do.

      If I am the type of person that wants to get it all done ASAP, I am not going to quit after I get it all done, I move to another character.

      However, if I am the type fo person that wants to get it all done ASAP, I might quit if I feel there is nothing I can do.

      So yes, if they want people coming back next week they have to not limit things.

  6. I think that for once I was more organised than someone. My Warlock was the only character not levelled to 90, so all Timeless Cloth items got posted at the end of a session.

    Needless to say I managed iLevel 494 in about 30 minutes. I just need to get everything gemmed and enchanted.

    1. The priest is sadly on a solo server so no other chars there to assist him and blizzard has not quite figured out how to make BoA items actually BoA items yet or I would have had everything for him.

      Have to love having all the extras to funnel some love the way of a new char to 90. I am going to level a few new chars once realm merging is done, being I will then be able to make more. Does that sound bad? lol