Monday, October 13, 2014

Monday Random Thoughts

- Did you get everything you wanted to get done before 6.0 came out?

- I didn't.

- I got a lot done, but most was done well before it got close to the cut off time.

- The only thing I really would have wanted to do that I missed was getting challenge mode golds.

- My guild mates were so against them from when we went in that first week and did not do so good.

- They did not have the desire to run out and reset a few times while we worked it out.

- They wanted to just run through them like any other dungeon.

- Then I had such a hard time finding groups for it.

- So I gave up on it basically.

- But them ending now gave me a chance to do something that perhaps was even better than getting gold.

- Even if I would have liked getting golds.

- I have all silver, and people wanted mount runs, which means silvers.

 - So I made groups and ran with them through silver runs.

- Silver runs are much easier and we even managed to do some with the 4 other people being completely new to the dungeon, and using 2 healers, because that was all that happened to be online.

- Still knocked out silvers.

- And that is the awesome thing that happened.

- I'd say there are now 13 guild members that were all afraid, for lack of a better word, to do them that now are kind of open to the idea.

- Somehow I was able to make it fun for them, even if I was telling them to run out and reset.

- For some reason them going away, and the sense of urgency, made people realize what I always had known.

- That working your way toward a goal was something that could be fun.

- Even one guy, who after his first attempt with me early in the expansion was a nightmare SPM run where we did not even make it past trash and everyone gave up after the second try said, if we had been doing this since the beginning we would be knocking out golds easy.

- Three of them we missed golds by less than 1 minute and this is with full groups that had never done them before or only had very limited experience.

- Goes to show them what I always say.

- If you work as a team long enough and put your mind to it, anything is possible.

- And if we had been doing these all expansion, like I had wanted to, we would all have golds.

- So next expansion is looking up, because now they all want to do challenge modes from the start next expansion.

- This will really help me and my enjoyment of the next expansion.

- With so little to offer, I am going to need to be with a group willing to do things like this or the game will lose my interest really fast as warlords is kind of light on the content department.

- It also does not hurt that you will have a chance to win 645 gear on that first week, and gear is good right?

- One bad thing is that so many really bad players keep asking me to come and I just can't say, sorry, can't take you, you are not good enough.

- It is mean.

- I might be grumpy, but I am not mean.

- So them removing challenge modes, while it sucks, I turned into a positive for my guild.

- Now lots of members want to start running them at the beginning next expansion.

- Because they finally realized what I said when we tried them at the start was true.

- It is only hard when you are learning them, once you know them, it is fun to try to best your best timer.

- Lets just hope they do not realize they are easier now because we have more gem slots. ;)

- But I do not need to tell them that do I?

- I am sad that they are going away now that I finally found a group of people worth doing them.

- Too little, too late.

- Still going to try to pick up a group for SPM gold so I can get the title.

- From the shado-pan of course.

- If you do SPM gold and all the shado-pan daily achievements, which I had as soon as I got to do them,  you get the title shado-master.

- Now tell me, who would not want the title shado-master on their shadow priest?

- It would help if I had a shadow priest of course, but the title is still something I really want.

- Saturday morning I spent 4 hours on open raid looking for a CM group for gold.

- I have all silvers, some which have a time that is only seconds off golds, yet I could not find a group.

- I said I have AotC and CE, still could not find a group.

- I said I have my own invis pots, the 18 second ones, still could not find a group.

- I said I have a helm with a real gem, not the useless legendary one for them, still could not find a group.

- I said I have the two BiS trinkets for CMs, still could not find a group.

- So having experience, proof you play at least decent, consumables, a special set of gear, and are not new to any of this means nothing.

- So what do you want, I asked.

- 9/9 gold.

- Excuse me?

- If I had 9/9 gold I would not be looking for a group, I would already have it and once you have gold there is no reason to ever do them again unless you were going for server best.

- Their pug, their rules, but sometimes it makes no sense to me.

- If I had gold, I do not need to pug on open raid.

- If I had gold I could easily get "gold experience only" groups on my server and not need to go to open raid.

- Going to open raid, for me, is the last resort, and it means I need something, not I have something.

- People confuse me.

- There are a lot of people selling gold runs.

- I have absolutely no problem playing for a run.

- Heck, I would even pay real cash if need be.

- I wrote a post a few weeks ago saying I would pay someone to do the work of assembling a good non fail group for me, so what would be the difference in paying for a run.

- Basically it is paying for someone to assemble a non fail group for you.

- But the prices these people ask are completely out of line.

- In my opinion at least.

- There must be enough people buying them for them to keep selling them.

- Talked to one person on open raid that told me he makes somewhere around 300K a week for him and his 3 friends selling CM runs.

- No wonder some people are upset to see these go.

- Even split 4 ways that is a hefty sum for a few hours work a week.

- But people were asking for sick numbers, in my mind.

- 50K per dungeon, and going up because time is running out.

- The only one I would pay 50K for is SPM right now and I would still kick myself for doing it.

- 2K, yeap, 2K max is what it would be worth paying someone to assemble a non fail group for 1 run for me.

- Now that I would jump on.

- 500 gold for each of the four players for less than 30 minutes of their time, in most cases.

- Seems fair to me, as the buyer.

- But who would sell for that.

- Heck, I would not even sell for that.

- If there were someone willing to pay me 50K for one run I would never even entertain 2K.

- So I do not fault people for getting what they can, more power to them.

- One of my servers had a great challenge mode advertisement.

- They said, don't need gear, don't need skill, just show up, come naked if you want to, gold guaranteed.

- I wonder what the price is.

- Never asked, I only have 9K on that guy on that server and I know I could not afford it.

- But naked might be the only way I could do it on that guy.

- He doesn't really have gear and with no gold he doesn't really have gems or enchants either.

- And as anyone that had done CMs knows, those gem slots are freaking huge.

- Now for something completely different.

- I did everything else I wanted to do prepatch, so nothing else to talk about on that front.

- I am hoping hunters are that one mistake.

- You ever noticed that every time the sim numbers come out, while they are kind of close to how things really are, there is always one class they made some math error with.

- Right now my only hope for hunters is that we are the one class they made a mistake with this time.

- My guild plans to run with its normal players once the patch comes out, just so we can test them.

- Kind of sucks our guild has a shadow priest, hunter, feral druid, you know, all the people at the bottom of the level 90 list.

- I heard that SoO will be nerfed a bit to compensate and be easier.

- Someone made a comment on the PTR that heroic SoO (which will be mythic) is roughly the difficulty level of what normal SoO (which will be heroic) is now.

- If that is the case than having all the bottom of the chart classes will not hurt us too much.

- If we can handle heroic now, I am sure if we can find a few more people and be able to handle mythic if that is the case.

- I plan to test the bottom spec on our first run, survival.

- I want to see if I can get more out of it than the sims say we can do.

- I can't even remember the last time I was only doing 10K.

- Would have to be early ICC before the buff started.

- I heard some people talking about old numbers and someone said how horrible hunters where in the cataclysm prepatch.

- I started scratching my head wondering what universe they were from.

- Hunters, after the cata pre patch, were the gods of PvE, even more so MM when you reforged everything to mastery.

- The mastery was insane.

- Makes me wonder, do people just pull stuff out of their ass when they say things like that, or were they insanely bad at playing a hunter back than and never realized to take advantage of the huge power of mastery when it was added at 80 in the pre patch.

- Trust me, if hunters were bad after the patch, I would have been the first to complain about it.

- Heck, that is what my job is, see the title.

- I look for things to be grumpy about, and I would never pass up a chance to be grumpy about my class doing poorly.

- So no, hunters were not bad in the cata pre patch.

- Not even legendary warriors could come close to me after the cata pre patch as a mastery reforged MM hunter.

- It was fun to be that OP, even if only for a short time.

- A lot more fun than it will be to be so UP, even if it is only for a short time.

- I will wait to test things, but looking at what we have, this seems to be the worst pre patch I recall for hunters.

- But I do not recall the wrath pre patch because I was not quite into the game at the time and was not a forums person back then.

- Like 95% of the player base.

- I can't wait to see what people say after they log in on tuesday.

- There were people talking about it in one of the guilds I am in while I was popping over there.

- I was mostly listening to them but it sounded like they were all me.

- They all said the same thing, that no one is going to have a clue.

- And then half their guild was asking, what is changing.

- Glad to see it is not just my guild that is half clueless.

- Most of the player base is clueless.

- And this is a raiding guild, and there were raiders, and they still had no clue.

- There were three people that seemed up on things and those three started explaining everything to people.

- You would not believe the outrage from people finding out that they only had one day left to do things like brawlers guild, proving grounds and challenge modes.

- These people, daily players that are on every day, had no clue any of this was happening.

- Blizzard really needs to work on their information sharing.

- Instead of the blues making stupid smart ass replies that answer nothing on twitter they need to have more in your face announcements in game.

- Like as soon as they are going to do something, have a pop up people need to click okay on when they log in.

- Like when you log in you would get a random pop up with something like "Did you know that on Oct 14th challenge modes are being removed from the game?"

- Maybe this would pass along the information some.

- Even if people ignore it, it would be better than not telling people at all, which is what blizzard does.

- And no, do not say they add patch notes.

- How many people actually read them?

- Maybe me and 1% or 2% of the other geeks do.

- No one else really reads those.

- And blizzard should know that by now.

- There are three people in my guild that read patch notes, that I know of.

- Everyone else just comes to us three to tell them what is going on.

- For most people, that is just easier.

- So what happens to the vast majority that do not have a support network and people to ask?

- They get shocked and maybe, just maybe, they quit, because all this was dumped on them with no warning.

- And again, don't say there was notice outside of the game.

- You should never need to go outside of the game to find out what is going on with the game.

- That is one upgrade blizzard should have worked on for the expansion.

- Upgrading how they share information with their players.

- And stop using twitter for notices.

- There we go, I am full on grumpy again.

- Can't have that, we have to be happy.

- There is some new stuff to do this week.

- I will NOT be heading to the blasted lands when the patch drops.

- I will wait a little bit so the rush goes down.

- Oh who the hell am I kidding, I will head right over there and then yell at my screen as I wait for an hour to kill three mobs because blizzard never fixed their spawn rates even after so many people put in tickets.

- Why do they ask us to test things when they completely ignore input sometimes?

- Some things they are awesome at fixing quick but others, like respawn rates, they suck at fixing.

- I should wait, I want to wait, but I will break down and head there, I know it.

- I am a weak weak elf, I admit it, I must do new content the day it comes out and can not control myself. /sob

- But I am going to try to hold out.

- I will tell you what I will be doing however.


- It has a 550 dagger with my rogues name on it.

- I've been wearing a 502 one since, well, the ToT LFRs came out.

- I would really like to see what I can do with some real weapons.

- On a nice stand still fight like ordos, even with no timeless buffs, I can get as high as 309K, which was my best.

- Got lucky, usually around 280K on that one to be honest, but it sounds better to say 309K doesn't it?

- I wonder what I could do with some weapons.

- Isn't it sad that I can get close to 300K standing still yet on a fight with adds or lots of target switching I struggle to to even half that, if that much.

- That is the skill of being a melee and I never play it enough to learn to get good at it.

- Combo points on the rogue will help me tons with it, I think that is where I mess up most on it.

- I lose a lot to dangling combo points never used left on a target.

- I am really looking forward to trying gladiator stance on my warrior.

- I've been saying for far to long that if I could DPS with a shield I would.

- So I guess I have to put my money where my mouth is and give it a try.

- And warrior AoE is nice and easy and they are looking very over powered for next expansion.

- So something I always wanted is being added, they are over powered, and I would love to find a melee class I enjoy outside of enhancement means I might as well give it a try.

- In truth the thing I am looking forward to most in warlords,at this moment, is gladiator stance.

- What does that say about the expansion, when the most exciting thing it has to offer me is something on an alt I still most likely will rarely play.

- Not a good sign for the expansion if you ask me.

- GOLD MAKING TIP:  Check out some old weapon enchants for the patch.

- Mongoose becomes BiS for feral druids, so they will be selling like wild fire.

- Be the first to put them up on the AH and sit back and collect the gold.

- And they are not the only ones.

- There are many enchants from wrath and BC that are going to be BiS enchants now.

- You have you one tip, you can figure out the others yourself. ;)

- They fixed the outhouse in beta.

- So now you get an achievement for doing number two.

- I thought the last time anyone cheered for us using the potty we were still in diapers.

- Which for most of us was a very long time ago.

- But now we are getting potty trained warlords style.

- I am already making my goals for warlords as far as leveling goes.

- Hunter to 100 first, as if that was ever in question, then all my other characters through the entry experience.

- Once I open the garrisons I will do a few quests, long enough to get to the quests for their profession buildings and another follower or two, then move to the next character.

- Once I have the garrisons open on all of them, so I can start leveling followers on all my alts and get all the profession buildings started, I'll decide on who to level to 100 next.

- My intention at the moment is to level my druid second.

- But we all know how that works out.

- I just kind of wing it when it comes to which alt to level second.

- I am still wondering how the hell my rogue was my second 85 in cataclysm.

- I am sure I had a reason at the time and maybe this time there will be a reason to level something else second.

- But being I can tank and heal on my druid I think that is why it will be second.

- I think my rogue was second in cataclysm because of the stupid chaos orbs being bound.

- So I needed to level him as he is my leather worker so I could make gear for my hunter.

- Still never understood why they make stuff like that bound.

- Speaking of bound, spirits of harmony will no longer be bound once 6.0 comes.

- And you will no longer need to go to the sliken fields to do the cloth daily.

- Which means I can trade all my spirits to my tailor and pound out some cloth and make more bags.

- Ah, bag space, I love bag space.

- Speaking of bag space, the reagents bag is what I am looking forward to in 6.0.

- And the toy box, and the second void storage tab, well, anything that has to do with space.

- I've been bouncing cloth and other things between characters for months waiting for it.

- I can't wait until I get stacks of 200 and more space for stuff like that.

- How much do you want to bet I will fill them all before warlords even comes out?

- Yeah, I am that bad.

- But when these old enchants are selling as BiS this week and everyone needs to farm for the materials I'll already have them, because I am a pack rat.

- Thing is, will I actually make them and list them.

- I never do.

- I always get caught up in doing the new stuff that I forget about making gold.

- Someone asked me what I think they should have for each character going into warlords, gold wise.

- I said, figure 30K to be a good number.

- You can buy and build every single building with 30K, so it gives you a buffer if you want to switch.

- You could make due with less of course, but 30K would be the "pay no mind" number where you will not even need to think about it.

- So that is my goal, 30K on all my characters.

- I spent a ton on pets recently so I am basically broke based on what I am used to having.

- Down to a hair under 600K on my main server.

- But I stocked up on some pets that I figured were good deals, and some I needed.

- Pets from the timeless island will go up because people will not be there farming all the time because there is nothing to do like now with the extreme content lull.

- So that death adder that I got for an amazingly low 200 gold will be worth a lot more later.

- Heck, it is worth a lot more now.

- I looked and on 3 of my servers it goes for around 2K.

- Wonder why someone listed it for 200.

- Maybe a typo?

- I've done that before.

- Sad when you were trying to sell a stack for 20 gold per item but you sold it for 20 gold for the stack.

- Yeah, I have done that.

- I never asked for my money back, but when I buy deals like that I have had people ask me for their item back.

- Sorry, can't do that.

- I had someone whisper once on a piece of gear I bought for 800 gold saying I owed them 7200 gold because they meant to sell it for 8000.

- I said I don't owe you anything because I meant to buy it for 800 and would have never given it a second though for 8000.

- I did offer to work a deal out with them for what would be fair for both of us, but 8000 was completely out of the question.

- I would have given him 3000 which mean another 2200, which is more than anyone else that bought it would have offered.

- They would have told him his loss and put him on ignore.

- He told me to send him the item back or 7200 gold or he would report me.

- I said you are not getting the item, you are not getting more gold, and if you want to report me for buying something you listed on the auction house feel free to.

- Not sure if he ever reported me, but I never got any mail or contact from a GM which means he either didn't, or the GM laughed at him the same way I laughed when he said he was going to report me.

- Mistakes happen.

- One time someone bought something I listed for a high price and they did not want it.

- They sent me a mail saying that they bought it by accident but they do not want their money back, it was a lessen learned, I just better spend the gold on something good.

- See, now that is someone that knows how it works reacts.

- They accept that they made a mistake and try to use it as a learning experience.

- Ever get mail sent to you that is not meant for you?

- With merged servers that seems to happen more often than it used to.

- I always send it back to the person and put a note in the mail saying I think they can use it more than I can but thanks for offering to give it to me with an lol at the end.

- I wonder if sometimes I am just being a sap.

- Most people would just keep it.

- I'd say half the time the person does not even reply with even a thank you when I send them their stuff back.

- I know I must have mailed stuff to the wrong person over the course of the years.

- No one has ever sent it back to me.

- But I am sure I have done it.

- I am a little paranoid about sending stuff to the wrong person sometimes.

- That is why I keep a few of the timeless pieces around now and always will.

- Whenever I mail something of real value I throw it in the mail.

- Being it is BoA, and you can not send a BoA to anyone but yourself, it gives me a sense of safety to include it in the mail.

- I know that I did not accidentally send it to the wrong person because it can only go to me.

- Maybe I could have labeled that one a pro tip.

- But a real pro would never be stupid enough to mail something to the wrong person.

- Or would they?

- Have a great day, see you on patch day.


  1. You'll definitely be able to out-dps the sims. They're ridiculous for 90 and 100, I think. Even just simming myself in PvP gear at 100, I can go 3-5k more dps than the sim. I haven't actually tested level 90, but I have tried levelling with guildmates, and on rares that stay alive long enough, I can still out-dps them without thinking about it.

    I believe hunters are low. but not that we'll be doing 50% of the top DPS'ers damage. That might be accurate for people who don't think about their rotation at all, but I can't imagine it would be true for you.

    I kept meaning to do get the shado pan title, but I just couldn't make myself do more dailies. I did the absolute minimum possible to get exalted, and then never went back. I don't even think I was looking at the achievement when I did dailies, probably should have. Maybe I could have gotten it done in that amount of time.

    I can't believe people are selling CModes for 300k still. they had gotten pretty low, I think I saw 120k for full golds. The lowest we went when selling them was 140k, and at that point it didn't seem worth it, I could get more gold killing trolls/dinos up on the isle of giants in the same amount of time. probably could get more gold questing in the same amount of time.

    1. What the heck?

      How do you make more than 140k in a few hours of killing trolls/dinos, or questing?

      I am doing WoW wrong apparently.


    2. I am not as much worried about 100 because I have been running dungeons and stuff and I am really doing fine in them, but it is the 90 stuff that seems out of whack the most and I have not tested that. Looking forward to giving it a try. I do wish they worked a little more on keeping 90 balance even if it is just a transition patch, because there is now timed content tied to it, as in heirlooms to get on multiple hunters. ;)

      I did the dailies when they first came out and did all the achievements as soon as they popped up in the quest line up. So I have been done with them for near 2 years. Just need that CM gold now and I do not see myself getting it sadly because I do not have the patience to sit in open raid any more.

      There are better ways to make gold, that is for sure. And even if I could "sell" runs I never would. I would drag a guild mate or friend for free before I would think of selling a run. But that is just me. I value people over the gold I could get from them.

      There were some people trying to sell challenge mode runs for real cash on open raid saturday morning. Think they got banned however, they stopped posting after a while. Either that or they made a sale. Not sure.

    3. @Anon

      Don't feel bad, I must be doing something wrong too because I never made that much killing dinos, even when the pets were new.

      But I believe he means selling the pets from there. They were going for 3k-10K a pop on most servers for a while and you could easily get 50 or 60 of them in a few hours work. That would be my guess of what he is talking about. I have so many of them saved in a guild bank on one server. Plan to sell them much later on when no one is going back there any more, hope their value will go back up.

    4. 140k was split between 4 of us. Perhaps not the most casual players, but most decently geared players can find a way to make 35k in 3 or 4 hours. At the beginning of xpac, right when MsV opened, I was selling 476 mail/leather sets for 37k (20 for the chest, 17 for the gloves). And it definitely didn't take me 3 hours to grind the mats for them.

      And yeah, up on the isle o' giants, I kill all the zandalari trolls, including the war-god (who has a guaranteed large bag, small bag, and at least 4 (up to 16) reputation tokens, which sell for quite a bit of gold (and are BoA, so can be sent to poor characters on other realms). The dinos drop plenty of dinomancy tomes, which sell for a lot too. And billions of those little dino pets as grumpy mentioned, which can either be vended, or sold on the AH (or again, transfered cross realm for better markets or to help other toons).

      The war-god spawns every 30 minutes. So after all the trolls are dead, you can kill enough devilsaurs to buy a spectral porcupette, then go back and kill the wargod again.

      And I'm sure there are people who've found a lot better ways to make gold than I! I just use this method because I think it's fun. There's still a bit of challenge to it, but not so much that I can't do it while watching netflix in my other monitor. :-P

    5. I didn't feel bad at first selling them, because so very few people had them on our server, so it really felt like a service to people that was worth while. As we've approached 6.0, i've been helping guild mates get them. I think I only did 3 or 4 runs in the last couple weeks, but it is a lot more work without a team that knows what it's doing, so I feel like I've paid my dues.

      Really, I probably would have done the ones we sold for free if they had been with people I cared about. I mostly did it because I was having fun with that group. I love 5 mans in general. Getting to play with a tank I trust and healer who I know I can count is really fun for me. And it's really fun to be relied on, being trusted to protect the healer, or pull adds for the tank. It feels good to be needed, and push yourself to come through, I think.

      Much more fun than just plowing through a dungeon with no effort.

    6. I pop by there when I am on my hunter and kill the rare and the trolls on the ship. Takes a total of maybe 5 minutes to do that all and I usually end up with at least 4 pets. Even now that is 2K alone. Add in the other stuff from the big bag, small bag and whatever rep tokens you get if you sell them and you could be looking at 4K total minimum. So yeah that is still a good take.

      Use a treasure potion while there and you can, if really lucky, triple that with no effort at all.

      I guess that is the difference between you and I. I would "only" do it for someone I cared about. I would not do it for someone else even if they were paying me 200K. I am sure, for me, there are much more entertaining things to do than to run someone through there. Not sure if that makes me selfish or what. But I always feel like I can make money later, so I think that is why I would not carry for gold. I don't want to feel like I am wasting time. However, if the price was enough, anything is for sale, even my time. lol

      My problem with golds was usually a tank or healer issue. More healers. Do you know how I tank them now for easy silvers (being that is all I can make sure I get and that is all that matters)? We use a feral that does not even change gear, just spec. So a tank with no tank gear. CMs more than any other content in the game require a really strong tank and healer and I could not get them. But if I could have gotten a solid tank and healer I am sure I could have gotten gold with anyone else in the other 2 DPS spots.

  2. I didn't particularly care to get gold CM, or even try them at all. The Hunter CM armor didn't look all that awesome to me. I don't want a dead bear laying on my shoulder.

    Everytime time my character looks to the side the bear would say:

    "How ya doing!"
    "Nice Weather isn't it?"

    1. I wanted gold for achievement sake. I couldn't care less about the transmog, as you said I agree, it is not all that great looking. I just wanted silvers personally for the mount which I believe is pretty nice. Probably because it is unique.

      I transmog into what would appear to be street clothing. I probably have the only hunter trasnmog ever that looks like cloth. Too bad half the pieces are not longer in game or I would get it on all my characters. I really dislike the big armor look on hunters. How are we supposed to move like that.

  3. Wow, maybe Australians read more. I would say 80% of our raiders read patch notes. Probably because we're used to not knowing anything coz Americans get all the info!

    I am sorry that you didn't get your gold CMs done. But there are still 4 hours. Maybe, you might get lucky.

    1. I did not stress trying for gold. I only wanted silvers and got the 3 I needed this week. But I would have liked golds to say I did them, even if I was the only one that ever knew. You know what I mean? I just do not play with the "type" of player that digs that type of stuff like I do.

      I would PAY if 80% of my raiders would read patch notes. lol

  4. DPS hotfixes are here. SV will get buffs, some classes nerfs, hunters will proably end up nicely in the middle of the pack. That's just fine at the moment. We don't want to be top because that would make us eligible for premature nerfs before 100, and bottom because we'd not be taken along to SoO (or whatevs) anymore.

    "- Hunters, after the cata pre patch, were the gods of PvE, even more so MM when you reforged everything to mastery."
    I remember being benched (all but 1 hunter so someone could pick up the xbow) in our ICC 25m heroic raids because SV did so bad, mostly due to the lack of CS and other abilities. I don't remember about BM or MM being any better, but maybe we failed at theorycrafting there or you were one of the few who discovered that MM+Mas = good. Or was it a gear scaling issue? Anyhow the raid leaders were morons, and we (a fellow hunter I've always been playing with and still am) left and build our own raid from scratch on another realm in a guild we befriended during early classic/bc days. We were very successful in a 10m with TWO hunters. ha.

    - Saturday morning I spent 4 hours on open raid looking for a CM group for gold.
    Sorry you had to go through this. In any case it would be better to just make your own group at that stage of the game. It's end game, most people wo are able already did 9 Gold by now (or that's what people think). You'd have much more success with building your own group because there are lots of people just like you, but also baddies so it is definetely hard to make a good group and it takes time. Still, not as hard as trying to get in a group with experienced players. It sucks, that's for sure.

    "- Blizzard really needs to work on their information sharing."
    Yes and they also have to stop scraping content like they do now. Why is going back as l100 to old brawler's guild bad? Why shouldn't anyone be able to work towards the legendary cloak at l100? Also, why close that stuff now? Why not let it stay for another month, along with patching in infos (a letter from an NPC would be more than enough), notifying people about their removal? Nobody cares if the content has been nerfed. You can see the date of completion right on the achievement and leaving them in would really help the peace of mind of completionists who might have missed a change. Only recently I realised that brawler's guild would close down, I notified a friend who didn't have most card bosses, but it was too late. He didn't have a chance of collecting all cards (especially from farm, blingtron, archy...), as it takes a few weeks I'd say.

    1. Saw the SV changes, it was nice that they were added, can't wait to check them out when it goes live. It should be enough to lift us over tanks, but don't think it will lift us to middle of the pack. It is a start, that is better than nothing.

      I never played SV until cata. I was MM in wrath with the armor penetration cap build. When the changes came and reforging and mastery were added, I reforged everything I could to mastery and was basically doubling my attacks because mastery gave an extra attack and I was over 80% mastery so that means almost always an extra shot.

      Add that to having Zods which sometimes gave and extra shot and it was insane. My shots were giving me shot that were giving me shots that were giving me shots. After the patch we went to sindragosa and they pulled both trash packs at the same time. I hit one multi shot, which was the new one, and thousands of arrows came out, my entire screen lit up, I crashed. I came back and people were telling me I capped out over 2M DPS, 1.7M DPS, 2.2M DPS. Depending on the meter it was all over the place.

      Sure they fixed the mastery shortly after, but there was no doubt a mastery MM hunter was a god. 2M in wrath? Heck, people still can't do that. lol

      I was only going for gold because it was something to do. I got silvers and that is what I really wanted. I get what you mean but it never made sense to me. People ask for 9/9 gold to get into a gold run. Excuse me? If I have 9/9 gold I do not need a gold run. Some might say, that shows you know it. Sure, it shows I know it. But even if I were 9/9 gold on my four hunters if I went on my rogue saying I was a 4x 9/9 person I would still stink up the place. So just because one character has gold does not mean I could do it on another, because I could never do it on my rogue.

      I do agree however, most people figure if it mattered you would have it already and I would be better off starting my own group but I did that at the start of the expansion and it was a nightmare. That is why I never finished them. After weeks and weeks of not even getting to the first boss of any one I went to, I gave up on them. It was impossible to find decent people that wanted to do them. The only people that wanted to do them was people that could not do them.

      I've said the same, why is going back to get the legendary a bad thing, why is going back and getting heirlooms off garrosh a bad thing, why is old content a bad thing. I am sick of them removing stuff for no reason what so ever.

      I always say that. I have a heroic garrosh kill. it was late, in june, does it take anything away from the people that killed him before me, no they did it before it. No one cares, that is why there are dates on the thing.

      Bling and farm too me a while. I did them as soon as they were added, collected at least. I finished the cards when they announced they were being removed. A friend of mine, who does bling every day, never got the one from bling and that was the only one he needed and missed because of it. Can you believe that bad luck? Poor guy. A hunter too. I am going to start calling things like that hunter luck.

  5. The thing with the Number tweaking is, the SV buffs were added along with nerfs to other classes. Therefore i deduced that we will probably do just fine. I might be wrong but I wouldn't be too worried at the moment. Funny thing is, they buffed def warriors, so maybe those will keep up with SVs? :D

    That were interesting times pre cata. Honestly I can't remember too much. Had a lot going on in RL at that time and I've got a horrible memory. Just the part of being benched kinda stuck with me. It is very likely that we either didn't do our work properly (we were 3 hunters, mind you), or the MM-mas crazyness was only very brief. 2.2m is possible nowdays however, I've managed to pull it off briefly once or twice on Garrosh H (1st adds after pull). Mostly I cap at around 1.8m though.

    I guess the logic behind people wanting 9/9G is that they just want to quickly get it for alts, and want people who know the place (you're right that it doesn't mean that you can play the class). Same as "lfm flex 1 need ilvl 570". They don't want do lose time to progressing, because they've already done that, and adding stupid prerequisites reduces the risk of getting a baddy. Or, the worst kind, are just bad and need to make sure that they get carried. Random groups just work like that, since you can't be sure how well people play without spending much more time going through their profiles.

    As a heroic raider who got the garry kill back in Feb, i agree with you on the notion that nobody took anything from me by killing him in July or so. Gear was buffed massively in May (or June?). I know that, and don't care. Because I also know what my group has achieved and what it's worth. People who don't see the difference aren't worth a dime and usually not the kind of people I'd like to play with anyway.

    The brawler's guild removal is just stupid. I don't understand it. A new season brings new mobs right? Why not just add them on top of the old ones once the old ones have been done? Your example just shows how stupid it is. I hate it.

    1. ahhh i clicked the wrong reply button, sorry.

      i wanted to add, if you wish to build your own group, you should not be too shy and add prerequisites too. like that they already got silver (if you have). proving grounds gold (or endless wave x). CM gear. and so on. just make sure that you meet them yourself. it will take a bit longer to find people, but those examples aren't hard to match, if the person is willing to put a little effort in it. if not, then you don't want them. but i realise it's easy to give advice and really hard to go through.

    2. I wish they would have done more for prot paladins. They are going to be really sad, as in more sad that poor survival hunters in terms of tanking. How the hell can a prot paladin hold aggro, even with the 500% treat buff, against people bursting? I don't see it happening.

      The MM thing only worked for a week like that, then they changed the mastery to not proc off the zod proc and multi shots and it went to normal, but it was insane. Even after the nerf with the ICC 30% buff it was easy to pull 20K or more and the only class in the game that could do that was warriors with the legendary.

      I remember it so vividly because it crashed me because my whole screen lit up with numbers. It was funny and not something I would ever forget.

      Some people making groups are smart enough to know the difference between things but as you said they just look for high numbers as there is, sadly, no other way to judge people. Even saying CE on main means nothing. Even if you say main is same class as this it means nothing. That I find odd. If I am on a lower geared hunter alt and have CE on another hunter, it shows I know how to play a hunter right? I can see saying no I am not taking you on your priest because you might be able to DPS it but it does not mean you can heal it. But to say you might be able to DPS on that hunter but doesn't mean you can no this hunter makes no sense. Even more so when talking for lower content like flex. I would rather take a 540 that knows what he is doing than a 570 that doesn't any day.

      But that is why I no longer assemble my own groups most of the time. I got tired of trying to sift through all that stuff. So many people claiming they are better than they are and so many others saying, just try me and I will prove to you and then all those people that drop at the first sign of trouble. It makes running a pug a nightmare. I credit the people who do the work assembling, but I've been jaded this expansion, that person is no longer me.

      I do not know why they did not leave these first 8 levels at 90 and add 8 new levels at 100. So big deal if someone starts next expansion and plows through the first 8 levels. I don't mind that they did it 2 years after I did.

      I think, but have no proof, that they are removing it as a time saving technique so they can just buff the same bosses and not have to make new ones. It is a lazy way out.

    3. I think asking for silver first would be good. Nothing wrong with that. It means they know the run and just need a better group than the one they were in. Still will not help if they were the bad one in that group, but it would limit issues for sure.

      I would never ask for endless because I would never do it myself. I got gold in proving grounds, never went back. Heck, I would not use proving grounds as a prerequisite for anything.

      I've been healing on my priest for 7 years I think, I healed heroic progression this expansion, and no, not while over gearing it, still only 569 (it is an alt) which is not huge. So I know how to heal on a priest and it took me HOURS to even get silver. Silver!. I would have had to reforge to get more spirit but being I run a super low spirit build and it scaled me down I was OOM forever and refused to reforge just for PGs. Yet, on my druid, whom I had not healed on since wrath. I made some timeless gear and went over to the PG and almost got gold on the first attempt. Someone died when the last mob was about to die, so it is as good as gold, because in the real game when a mob is sub 10% and one DPS dies it is not a wipe, even more so when I could have thrown out a battle rez.

      With that said, PGs prove nothing. A healer I am good at had trouble with silver and a healer I had basically not played in 6 years can get gold on their first try. Yeah, I would never ask for PGs.

      I am against having PGs silver as a lock to queuing for heroic dungeons. I suggest another test before being allowed to queue for a heroic. You have to go into a simulated paragons heroic with 24 other NPC players in the fight and actually survive the entire time. No need to beat it, put a three minute timer on it, if you can survive for 3 minutes, you can queue for a heroic dungeon. If you can't, learn how to do things and then you can join. Because if you can survive there, that means you can survive anywhere.

    4. Heh. PG is kind of a two edge sword. Some people like it, some don't. I do. There's the whole class imbalance issue, of course, which sucks, as it depends a lot on how well a class can deal with multiple target. However it shouldn't make much difference in sub gold leve.s I'll just talk about hunters now because it's the only class i did the thing with. Silver is a no-brainer for anyone who has a rough idea of how the class works. Just don't worry and kill stuff, all you need to know is being explained to you as you go. Gold isn't much harder for anyone who knows the most common tricks (proccing ES with a trap e.g.). I didn't need to prep with CM gear or flasks and got it without reading it up beforehand on 2nd try or 3rd as a BM. For endless, you'll need to sport your CM gear, which is a bigger deal, but completing. I did it and would say, anyone who manages to do 30+ waves, can call him/herself skilled. I did all as BM a while back, and then went back yesterday as SV just for the fun of it, and holy moly, it is a hell lot easier. Got to 27 or so waves without remembering it all properly. Anyway, seeing the achievement flash up feels very rewarding and in the end it's worthwile.

      For ambitious players, PG certainely is interesting content. But not too interesting either, as endless takes a lot of time because after every fail, you have to start over at wave 1, which is getting boring once you got the hang of it. I failed a lot in the earlier waves to lack of attention (was whispering, reading stuff on my mobile etc... ^^)

    5. but i like your klaxxi idea. heh. i've been with lots of SoO heroic pugs. ya know, those who want 14/14h xp. but without exception, 5 people die on the first rapid fire. i don't know if i should find this sad or hilarious.

    6. that said, endless PG is almost all about positioning (amber globules are a huge deal) and priorising the right targets. all in all it tests lots of important skills. burst, positioning, interrupting, aoe, multi targetting (not stacked), etc. there's also shit to stand out of or you lose damage, which usually fails your attempt.

    7. I think what turned me off on endless more than anything else was, as you said, it takes a lot of time. I am not a big fan of wasting time unless I am enjoying something and I did not enjoy that. If I just wanted to mindlessly kill mobs I would go out in the vale and farm for sky shards. At least I am getting something for doing it and that makes it enjoyable for me. So it the end I always looked at it as I have better things, more fun things, to spend my time doing.

      If I only played my hunter and not 20 characters and multiples of them being hunters, I might have done it because I would have ran out of things to do when bored. But when I look at it as "waste time in PG on my hunter" or "pug a normal to gear up my priest" guess which one won? 100 out of 100 times, gearing up my priest would win over wasting time in the PGs.

      But I can see why a lot of people like it. It is a personal challenge and some people gravitate to that type of entertainment just as I do like leveling alts. We each like different things.

      Rapid fire always gets someone. I think it would be good because it teaches encounter awareness which sometimes bothers me more than bad dps, bad healing or bad tanking. I hate doing an LFR and you see someone standing in something and they are like "but the healers can heal through it". I do not care if the damage is trivial, you still need to move from it.

      I am sure people that run with me and can hear me on vent must think I am a dick sometimes because I keep telling them things like, I do not care if it is old content, you still need to do the right thing. Nothing irks me more than people not knowing what is going on around them.

      I think it is just a bad habit to get into to stand in things sometimes because it is okay. Just always move, so when the time comes that you have to move, you do it without even thinking because it is habit.

      I tried to do gold damage dealer on my disc priest yesterday before it went bye bye and I could not manage it. But that, I found fun. I kept making adjustments, noticing things I had in my tool box that I forgot about, I mean when do I use mind sear? But that, to me, is fun. Doing something the way it is not supposed to be done. That I could get into.

    8. yeah i can understand where you're coming from. i'm the other way round: levelling alts is cumbersome, i like questing and all but lose focus and patience really fast. and i won't ever consider to equip them properly, the only reason i have high level alts are professions so i can make gold. but i love to do everything available with my hunter (bar pvp. it gets boring/annoying/frustrating really quick and i have yet to meet decent people to consistently play with. i have tried several times. only open world ganking is fun). great thing this game has so much to offer!

      i fully understand your frustration with people not taking encounters and mechanics seriousely. getting out of fire should be a reflex, not something you do after waiting to see if the healing is enough. klaxxi is great to test that kind of skill: charge + RF + amber puddles at the same time? you better be very attentive and know where to stand. lots of people fail at that. to be fair, it IS hard, but not unmanageable with a little practice. i've been raiding with pug hunters that refused to go on the blackfuse belt "because they just couldn't do it". Guess what, i couldn't either at the beginning, but since i am playing the #1 class for belt, i went to flex, practised, and then practised some more. Little changes between flex and heroic, sure the fire beams are much more difficult but that's it, and they remain predictable. I had to find a technique to get my pet up on every belt too, and found it. It's all just practice. go deal with it, learn your path, learn to use disengage properly. I might have sound like an anus but i don't care. people need to pull their weight, i'm not carrying anyone who refuses to put in some effort.

      /end rant

    9. That is the great part of the game, it has a lot of things to offer. From you liking stuff like that to me liking creating an alt army, mostly of hunters, and to the other guy out there that might love PvP. The beauty is that there is something for everyone.

      I do belts for my team on multiple hunters for multiple runs but many times in pugs I will say I do not know how to do them just so I do not have to. I will if there is no one else there capable, but I do them for my raid, why should I "have" to do them for another team. I just want to pew pew the fight sometimes and I never get to do that on that fight in a guild group. It might be selfish but I just want to relax sometimes and do the easy role, even more so in a pug.

      I agree with you, we all learned somewhere, I do not see why others can not learn. As a hunter and a raid leader I always assign special duties to myself, not only because I have faith I can do it, but because I am the best class for it most of the time. We wiped when I was learned, maybe even wiped a lot on some fights, but that is part of learning. Sometimes you wait on the tank figuring out how to deal with the incoming damage and wipe, sometimes you wait on the healers figuring out how best to rotate abilities for big healing moments and you wipe, and sometimes you wait for the person on special duty to learn how to do it and wipe. It is how we all learn to play.

      I think what it comes down to is not so much them not wanting to learn, but that this is a pug. I do not mind wiping 100 times on a boss in my guild, did it on many bosses, but I do not want to wipe even once in a pug. I don't know these people, I don't care to know these people, and I will never see these people again, so I do not want to work "progression" with them. Usually I end up doing belts anyway because that is what it comes down to. Even if they tell me that they have someone else to do it. I would rather do it right (so someone else never gets the chance to learn) than to wipe with a pug while someone learns the fight.

      In my opinion, pugs are for people that already know the fights. A wipe or three here and there because of a mistake is fine, but wipes while people learn are not. I'd tel them to learn in LFR if you must. You can practice soloing belts there just fine. Just my opinion of course.