- Once again my random thoughts have a lot to do with the LFR.
- Maybe that is because the majority of my time this weekend was spent doing it on various characters.
- More and more I am sure that the new LFR is WAY over tuned for the audience that it is aimed at.
- They could do a blanket 25% nerf along everything on all the bosses and it would still be WAY to hard for half the people that are in it.
- A 480 item level for people that know how to play, even if they are only barely decent, makes it easy.
- When one in ten people, at most, is barely decent or better, it makes it hard.
- Did the first ToT one on my shaman yesterday and I should have known to drop the second I zoned in.
- I zone in to mid wipe on the first trash pack and turn and run out ASAP.
- I should have stayed out, but figured, what the heck, lets see if that was just a mistake.
- I get back in, with people leaving, yes after that first pull people were leaving, we have one tank and four healers.
- Tank runs right back in and starts pulling.
- The first pack, the pack after with all the little guys, and all this with only 4 healers and one tank.
- This is the type of group I always seem to get when I do not go with guild.
- I thought that the LFR was meant for people that did not have the time to raid with guild?
- I thought that the LFR was meant for people that did not have raid ready skills?
- The trash is not even pugable at the LFR level when stuff like the next pull happen.
- When we get another tank one tank pulls the roaming mobs, the other tank pulls the guy at the door, still with only 4 heals.
- Once again we survive, with some serious healing from yours truly and the other healers.
- That was not meant to toot my own horn there, those other healers were awesome.
- Found where the one in ten good ones were in this group, they were the healers.
- At the boss at least they let us get a fifth healer before they pulled.
- Now for today's episode of (said in a booming voice like a TV announcer) "Who's... fault... is it?"
- We wipe.
- One tank died 3 times, but until the end, that was the only death.
- The entire room fills with puddles and we have no place to go, but the healers keep everyone alive, even in the center for a massively extended period of time before people start to drop.
- We wipe when the boss still has 105M hit points left.
- So enter your guess on "Who's fault is it?"
- According the the raid, there were three people at fault but the underlining factor was it was the healers fault.
- The main tank was at fault for pulling with only five healers.
- The off tank was at fault for dying three times and not using enough cooldowns to help our woefully bad healers.
- And of course it was the healers fault because we did not do enough healing and that was why we wiped.
- WTF?!?!?!
- Everyone was alive when we reached full coverage.
- Everyone was at full health when we reached full coverage.
- Everyone was kept alive through some insane damage output at the end for a fair amount of time.
- The off tank died because he was a bad tank, not because of healer issues, as told by the fact that no one else died.
- How exactly is it the healers fault that you get to full coverage with the boss still having over 100M life?
- It was the fault of the damage dealers for sucking in proportions of suck I do not think I have ever seen before in my life even in the LFR.
- They sucked so much that those horrible healers had to constantly keep everyone up through people getting hit by the lightning in places they shouldn't.
- And everyone lived.
- That had to be the single most amazing healing performance I have ever seen in the LFR with the amount of damage that was going out.
- Everyone was taking every single bit of avoidable damage.
- Tanks were not switching fast enough causing more damage.
- And yet we still kept everyone alive through the whole thing.
- When I was doing 102K HPS with a 481 item level leading the pack and the last place healer was over 85K HPS, the healing was just fine.
- Honestly, there is no reason you should need 5 healers all doing over 85K HPS on that fight, ever.
- Healers fault my ass.
- But the raid went on and on how the healers suck.
- Thank you blizzard for this amazing addition to the game, and you wonder why there are so few healers, because of stuff like this.
- The system needs to add something that points out errors to the raid.
- When the fight was over the game should have announced that the tanks and damage dealers better kiss our asses and hope we stay because they all suck and the only reason they made it as far as they did was because of us.
- Next attempt we have a 6th healer for and we down it.
- Again, when the entire area is covered and from some huge heals keeping us up at the end as we started to lose a few people here and there.
- All because the DPS was that low.
- And when we downed it, you will never believe the balls someone had.
- They said, See, I told you if we got another healer it would be easier.
- The tank, the one that didn't die, finally spoke up.
- The healers were just fine, the problem is with the DPS, you guys suck, good luck on the next boss, I am out.
- And he left.
- I should have followed.
- Wiped on the next boss a few times before I just gave up after 2 plus hours of hell.
- I should have left after I zoned in to them wiping on the first trash pull.
- When will I ever learn.
- With all due respect I would like to ask 13 of the 17 damage dealers a question.
- How exactly is it possible to have a 480 item level and do under 50K DPS on a fight with a damage buff?
- Even if you are ungemmed and unenchanted and unreforged, you should be able to do more than 50K on that fight at a 480 item level.
- Eh, doesn't make a difference anyway, it was the healers fault.
- I will say one thing that was good about all that bad however.
- It made me get some serious practice in cooldown usage, mana management and moving while healing on a character I had not yet healed this expansion with.
- So even with bad there was good.
- Actually, bad groups are better to learn healing with.
- You run with good groups too long you get spoiled and forget how to heal under pressure circumstances.
- Don't know about other healers out there, but I love those high pressure healing moments.
- It is what I find fun about healing.
- Now to step away from my favorite ranting points lately, even if only for a moment.
- And on to the island.
- Got the achievement for the chamberlain by waiting until the weekend to do it.
- Was super easy, did it in 4 minutes and 14 seconds.
- Can't see anyone having any problems with that achievement.
- It was simple with multiple characters.
- Did it on one first, then did it on another to get the achievement.
- First one I saw where the 4 were that day, second one I chose where to start it and ran a preplanned the route.
- The first one I almost did it on as is, without trying.
- Got in a lot of fights along the way while looking for them and only missed it by 2 minutes.
- Did not even get caught in one fight on the time I did it for the run the second time.
- One straight run from one to the next and to drop it off, easy peasy.
- My death knight took their first venture on the island this weekend.
- It was really early sunday morning and the place was empty, so no help for rares really.
- So I decided to try and solo them, I mean, I am a DK right?
- I can tell you that at a 460 item level a DK can solo every rare on the island with no problem what so ever.
- Because I did and I am not really all that skilled with soloing on mine.
- So it should be super easy for any DK with skills, even at a lesser item level.
- I also learned another thing about my DK.
- I can not solo anything as frost.
- I decided to spec frost for the LFR, being I refuse to run as a tank.
- I then made the mistake of pulling a rare as frost.
- I did not last long at all.
- Note to self, ouch, do not try to solo as frost until you learn how to play it.
- Reading up on the DPS rotation alone was not enough to solo mobs.
- Oddly enough I soloed Prog on my shadow priest this weekend.
- A shadow priest? Soloing? I have to be delirious right?
- Nope, I did it, I swear.
- Had someone join me sub 5% but still I consider myself as having soloed it.
- I was actually amazed.
- I figured worst case would be I jump off and levitate if I get in trouble.
- Never came to that. Cool.
- Took my DK into the LFR for the first time, could only do the first two because of the item level, but six bosses and six coins, with the increased drop rate should get me something right?
- Who are we kidding, you know me better than that.
- I did win one piece, a weapon, so now up to 462.
- First time ever doing frost, not gemmed, not enchanted, gear that has parry and dodge on it, and basically no clue.
- I stunk it up as a melee DPS on will, getting hit by 3 out of 5 usually.
- Really don't know how I have no problem avoiding it as the tank but as a melee I never can.
- Guess it is because as a tank I know he is always aiming for me, so I know how to avoid it, but as a melee, with dancing tanks, I never can get a hang of it.
- One of those things that if I did it a few times I would probably get it.
- But the end of the fight I was down to only getting hit by one per five.
- I pulled 34K-39K on the bosses, high and low marks of course. The dragon was 54K but that does not count as it has a damage buff.
- I was usually 8th in DPS, or around that.
- Not sure if that shows I am a fast learner, or how bad the people in there really are.
- I will lean toward it showing how bad the people in there really are.
- If someone with tank gear in a DPS spec they never once played and only read about that day and only spent a few minutes on a dummy with, and one violent death to a rare with, can beat them, they really are that bad.
- Given time I am sure I could get okay with it.
- Seems to be a pretty simple rotation.
- Then again, after playing a hunter this expansion, everything seems like a simple rotation when comparing.
- Don't think I will ever be able to do the dance as melee on will.
- At least not in LFR with an unpredictable tank.
- If you know where the tank will be, you know where the blows will be, you can avoid them easier.
- At least for me it works that way.
- Like I said, no problem on my tank, massive problems on my DK.
- Noticed I had another problem with my DK.
- I was constantly moving in front of the mob, out of habit.
- Oops.
- One trash pull the tank goes down I pop blood presence and go offtank, being they were on me anyway, and go down faster than a thai hooker.
- Guess frost does not do well off tanking either, even if only for a few seconds.
- Either that or I just need to learn how to play it better.
- Now for a tale of two snakes, so to speak.
- Megaera, LFR, one super easy mode, one nightmare mode.
- And my new perfect example of what is wrong with LFR design.
- One run, get in, green head, red head, and back and forth.
- Nice and easy, no problems, kill is as it should be in LFR, push over mode.
- Another run, nightmare.
- People not agreeing which heads to do, so everyone on different heads. Wipe.
- 5% buff. People still on different heads, we wipe again.
- 10% buff. Finally get people to agree on heads, but they do blue red and back and forth. Wipe.
- 15% buff. Switch the green red combo again but someone keeps dropping fire in the rally points. Wipe.
- 20% buff. Why am I still here? Because at that rate it has to become a push over right? Wipe.
- 25% buff. Back to blue red because green red does not seem to be working, but some do not get the message. Wipe.
- 30% buff. Blue red and everyone is on the right ones, but some people just do not get that you run out of the group when you have the ice on you. They just stand there, wipe.
- 35% buff. How high can this buff go? Well after more idiots dropping ice in the group and other idiots not moving out of it when they notice that someone that has it is not moving I can tell you it goes to 40%. Wipe.
- 40% buff. Now I can't leave, even if I wanted to, too much time invested, sooner or later the thing is just going to fall over at the start, wouldn't you think? Kill.
- Woohoo, finally.
- I had already done the last boss on that character so it was not even a matter of considering it, I dropped it like it was hot.
- Maybe, just maybe, if things dropped loot more than once a week, I would have stayed, but to stay for 45 valor is just not worth it.
- They could have offered to mail me a check for 100 bucks and I would have not stayed.
- I've done this boss easy mode with a group of smart people, or at least not bad ones, and it is about as easy as easy can get.
- It is people dropping fire on the rally point that wipes us.
- It is people getting the ice on them and just standing in the group that wipes us.
- There should never be any ability in the LFR where one person can wipe the entire group like that.
- Never, ever.
- Seriously.
- It is like getting frostbite in the council fight.
- I try to get rid of it, to share it, and people run away from me.
- It makes me want to scream.
- Splitting this damage is good but people run from it, but sharing the damage from the torrent of ice is a bad thing and people just stand there with it, and in it.
- It really just makes me want to scream some times.
- May your tootsies not get frozen by all this ice talk.
- Have a great day all.
Blizzard Watch Weekly: Family togetherness
2 hours ago
why did you ask a question and then answer it? Argh, and I even had the answer to tell ya, but noooooo, you answered it. Dang it GE.
ReplyDeleteinteresting post. totally different than what I did - found a bug with monks, reported it, then found the answer and reported it too. Something so simple, I wonder why it wasn't fixed last week.
oh well. the tootsies are frozen already. 1 more snow in 2 weeks for our area.
-roo "the weather forecaster"
It is supposed to snow here today, they keep telling us that, but I see nothing.
DeleteWeatherman, the only job in the world where you can be wrong every single day you work and still get to keep your job.
mine's because of me ankle. Hurts like a "motha'" due to changes in the weather. Plus I also have a Gnome weather rock.
Deletehere are teh instructions for it's use -
• If the rock is wet, it's raining.
• If the rock is swinging, the wind is blowing.
• If the rock casts a shadow, the sun is shining.
• If the rock does not cast a shadow and is not wet, the sky is cloudy.
• If the rock is not visible, it is foggy.
• If the rock is white, it is snowing.
• If the rock is coated with ice, there is a frost.
• If the ice is thick, it's a heavy frost.
• If the rock is bouncing, there is an earthquake.
• If the rock is under water, there is a flood.
• If the rock is warm, it is sunny.
• If the rock is missing, there was a tornado.
• If the rock is wet and swinging violently, there is a hurricane.
Did first half of LFR. Greeted everyone as they came in took control. gave quick instructions for all boss's called switches for adds or for different boss's. not one wipe hardly any deaths. At the start some one tried to start shit with me but I told them don't be a jerk some people are new and need help. Guy actually apologized. Got three thank you tells before I zoned out of the instance. Be the change you want.
ReplyDeleteI have tried, I gave up. There are good groups and bad ones. A good group can be helped even with players that do not know what to do but a bad group is worthless and helping will only stress you out.
DeleteTrust me. I tried to help, too many times, I would occasionally get one thank you, if that, and it would be on rare occasion or I would get told one of two things, "it's only looking for raid just pull" or "shut up elitist jerk".
Excuse the language, but fuck 'em. They are not worth the time or effort to help any more. If someone asks for help I will gladly step up. If someone says they do not know the fight I will gladly explain. But I will never take lead of a group of 25 random people. That one thank you that I so rarely get is not reward enough. I wouldn't do it even if blizzard offered to pay me 2 grand a week to raid lead the LFR. It is not worth it.
So if you can't beat um join um got it..
DeleteAll I see is excuses in your response. I tried, they aren't worth my time, I only get one thank you. I do it because I want to set a good example of how I want my community to behave and if not us then who? We can belly ache all we want about changes we want blizzard to make but you can't design good community. The only people that have the power to fix the community is the community.
Bollocks.
DeleteI was once a young tank, back when there were no LFR, no LFD, back when people added tanks and healers to friend list to join dungeons and such. I used to help everyone that asked, I was so happy to do it, I was explaining stuff if people didn't know what to do. Then someone asked for my help to finish up 4 or 5 of his hero achievement for the red proto drake, I stayed and helped. After I helped him with the last one and he got the meta, he pulled every mob in the room and got me killed. That is when I started to change. I realized that
this game has brought out the worst and me and made me realize how mean people can be. That guy had absolutely no reason to do that, even if I hadn't helped him. But the fact that I'd helped him through 5 dungeons, requesting nothing in return, and he decided that is how my effort should be repayed made me really not want to help anyone anymore.
You read about people having bad experiences all the time. These aren't excuses, these are things that mar you and change you. I don't help people if they're not part of my guild or friends of theirs anymore. That way you not only know they won't screw you over at the end, but they'll also be greatful.
Back to the subject at hand...
You think anyone normal will keep on trying to explain things and help out when they get yelled at and called names? No. No one in his right mind would. Normal people get tired. Normal people get bitter. People need to know their effort is worth something to continue to do that something. What you say here is some idealistic thing that has no grounds in reality.
I always thought I had more power to change things since my voice rings louder as the tank. But what you get is what you read here - the tank that didn't die (meaning the one who knew what he was doing) ended up pointing out the wrongs (explained dps was at fault) but didn't want to get involved anymore so he left. THIS is where it ends up, not because you don't have the will to change things, but because the community changes you in time.
Some WoW quote comes to mind: 'To repeat the same action and expect different results is madness'
No, not if you can't beat them join them. That would mean becoming one of them.
DeleteI just keep quiet unless someone asks for help. No longer do I offer unsolicited assistance.
If anything, people would be better following my example. There is no need to explain unless someone asks for it. There is no reason to complain, even if someone has been doing badly. Just do your job, plain and simple.
As James said, you tend to get bitter after a while. While I don't always feel that way I find myself more and more feeling that way and just not wanting to help.
You’re both absolutely wrong. By letting them make you bitter and unhelpful you are becoming like them. You let them win when you are quiet and Unfriendly in this case doing nothing equates to the same thing as being a community troll. You act like I've never had bad things happen to me in this game. That’s not true I've had a ton of shitty experiences but I don't let it get me down.
DeleteOnce you stop trying to make a better community you lose the right to complain about the community in my opinion.
This 'community' is not an entity. It's made form real people. If this was 'real life', there would be people I'd want to avoid completely. If you see someone yelling on the street to someone else do you stop to get involved so you make the world better? This is how these people were taught to behave or how they want to behave. In WoW we don't deal with people that we're used to from our usual environment, it's young people, old people, people with lower comprehension skills or really smart people, people that are shy, people that have disorders. You can't impose yourself as if you'd talk to someone just like you. No one ever curses or swears in the environment I work / I was brought up. Everyone has gone to at least College. Should I try and educate someone of whom I know nothing about?
DeleteYou know what the tank did when he said the dps was the problem? He reassured the healers. He didn't try and explain because he realized the dpses wouldn't understand anyway it's their fault but he wanted the healers to know that he, at least, knows they did their job right. That's all the difference you can do without getting emotionally involved in a battle with the windmills. He made a difference by letting the healers know there's nothing wrong with them. What more would you have expected? What results do you think it would have brought?
Bitter and unhelpful is not being like them. It is just being quiet. Quite honestly, being quiet is the exact polar opposite of them. So not exactly sure how you equate that to being the same as them.
DeleteI also said I would always be willing to help. Never once did I say I do not help, just said I will not offer it in advance. But if someone needs help I will step up.
Did it last night in the LFR. Everyone was just sitting there, I asked a question in raid "how do we want to do this?" so it would start a conversation.
So people started saying it, explaining the fight, how they were going to do it, etc.
See, sometimes there are people that do not know what to do but are afraid to speak up. Me speaking up, even if I knew the fight, got someone to explain it, nicely, for the person that was afraid to ask.
Just because I am not vocal and I will not "play" with the trolls does not mean I am one of them. In my worse day even acting like a total jack ass, I am still better than they could ever dream to be.
@ James.
DeleteYou said that very well. This community is made up of so many moving parts. Sadly I think most of those parts are broken or like to use the internet as a vehicle to vent their frustrations taking them out on people they do not know and will never see.
I assure you every smart ass jerkwad you see in the LFR is someone that would NEVER act like that in real life. They are doing it to feel a level of power they do not have in the real world. Bad home life, work life, school life, whatever. They act like that in game because everywhere else in life they are the ones getting picked on. Makes you wonder, are we the bad guys for wanting to take away the only time they feel good about themselves? Well, from their point of view, we are the bad guys.
You nailed it with that tank. And I agree, there was no need for him to get any more invested in it. That is why he left. He told the healers do not listen to the masses, they did well. And he pointed out the real problem. It would not have been worth his time or effort to try to explain it to everyone there.
Could it be GE that you are on a bad server? Trust me, if you could get me into LFR and back out alive without dying, I would thank you so much, you would say "shut up!". But to get me you would have to be Rexxar. Thats where all me gold is.
ReplyDeleteLFR has nothing to do with server. Actually, if I get a run with someone from my server it is amazing. I think over all my characters I did a total of 18 LFRs this week, maybe more, and I only saw 1 person from my server in any of them.
DeleteIt is the people from other servers. It is the sense that they know they will never see you again so they can treat the entire group like crap to make themselves feel better.
I personally wish more people were like me and it made them feel better about themselves to know they put a smile on people faces instead of abusing them. I guess I am just a dying breed.
yup and a grumpy one at that. :D
DeleteI'm so happy I only needed to do LFR once, first week and that one went really well, like I'd expect from our 25m. So sometimes I'm tempted to join my guildies but then I remember horror stories like these.
ReplyDeleteI suppose it sucks to feel helpless - like no matter how hard you try and how well you do your job, someone can screw you over. So I totally agree with you on the one-person wipe mechanics in LFR - they shouldn't exist.
Even with the horror stories, remember it is not all of the runs. While it is true the bad runs of the new LFRs is upwards of 75% are bad, it is only because they are new. The older ones are the opposite, maybe 25% bad at most. Now at least.
DeleteThe problem is that 25% stands out a lot more then a smooth run would. A smooth run is like drinking a coffee in the morning. It is just there, you don't even think about it. But if you spill that coffee and it burns you, you will remember it all day long.
I wonder when blizzard will get the idea. No one person wipe mechanics in the LFR.
Here is how those one person wipe mechanics should be handled, to teach people.
A "you need to get away" when you have a debuff mechanic would be like this. Instead of you hurting other people when you have it by standing with them. If you do not move away from them within 3 seconds it is instant death.
It would teach them being near people with it is bad, but not penalize the healers by making them have to heal because of that mistake and will not penalize the other player by possibly killing them because of that mistake.
Now that is how one person wipe mechanics should be handled in the LFR. If you mess up what you are supposed to do it is instant death to you. Not the raid.
Had one of those LFR wipefests last night. Bad idea doing LFR on a Monday but I just didn't have time the previous week.
ReplyDeleteI've never seen that many people get vote-kicked out of LFR for griefing, blatantly ignoring mechanics to game the meters, etc. There was nothing fun about it.
At least I got the bow off Tortos although I'm debating if it's worth using since I have a fully upgraded LFR sha weapon. I think it's an upgrade but may not be a huge upgrade. Also sucks that it's got Hit on it and I can't get rid of all the excess hit I already have. It's so bad that I'm using Agility + Stamina gems in blue slots because I have too much hit...
It is sad that there are so many people that have more fun ruining the game for other than actually playing the game.
DeleteIt would be an upgrade, and a fair one at that. Remember, you can also go back to the black price and buy another slot for a gem to put on it, which in turn will make it even better. At least I believe they added the ability to buy additional gem slots once you have completed the quest.
I'm frequently explaining fights, telling people what to do ect in LFR and while I do like to help people, that's got nothing to do with it in that instance ;p I just want to kill the bloody bosses and get my loot (well, bags of gold...) and get out, if telling people how to do things right increases my chances of doing it faster I see it as just as beneficial to me as turning up knowing how to play my char. I'd much much rather spend a min or 2 typing out what to do in the hope enough understand and listen to let us kill the boss than wipe and hope they do better next time ;p
ReplyDeleteIncidentally, never ever kill blue on LFR. Honestly the worst possible thing to do, it'll inevitably target someone clueless with ice who'll get people killed. At least with red the smart people will move out of fire if someone drops it on them, the dumb people who just stand there and die probably weren't doing much dps anyway. Killing blue and having ice, moving away doesn't work as well since sometimes the derp with no idea just follows you like a sheep!
Most people would have no problem telling the people what to do. It is that you are bound to get someone that disagrees with you, or someone that will outright call you an idiot because they do it differently and then again there is that other person that will always say, it is only the LFR, just pull and a forth person that will say, I have already done this on heroic so that means I am god and you have to listen to me.
DeleteSure, in a good group one person steps up but in most groups you usually end up with too many chefs.
The biggest offender I have seen so far is the heads. Someone will say green red, someone will say blue red, someone will say just kill them in order and other will say attack whatever you want and then the tank says, lets go and pulls and there is no set decision on what we are doing. That fight is a nightmare.
And I agree, never blue, but try saying that when Mr. I've done this on heroic which makes me smarter than you, belittles you because you have only done it on normal (or perhaps not at all) and that means you do not know what you are talking about.
I try to take lead when I heal. I always feel in a power position when I heal. When I DPS, I just follow the flow, keep my mouth shut, top the charts and follow mechanics. That is the exact way every single damage dealer in the game should always act.